Philly Masjids: “We will not bury this Muslim”
UPDATE 05/11/08 6:00AM EST: I received this from one of the brothers involved at the Germantown Masjid:
There are two points that NO ONE has bothered to mention:
(1) The brother at the center of the controversy (may Allah have mercy on him) was NOT a member of Germantown Masjid, nor did he frequent the masjid. As a matter of fact, none of the three allegedly involved were members of Germantown Masjid.
(2) The brother was washed, prayed over, and buried as of Friday May 9, 2008. All of the talk about him being Muslim upon death, sins don’t take you out of Islam, he has rights, etc. needs to cease.
UPDATE 05/09/08 11:30PM EST: Philadelphia Mayor Micheal Nutter sent the following letter to the Muslim community. He also spoke on this issue here:
Dear Muslim Faith Leaders,
As you know, a Philadelphia Police Officer has been shot in the line of duty. It has been widely reported that the assailants were wearing “muslim garb” as a disguise during the attack.
I want to make it clear that I do not think that this crime was an act of violence directed from or against the Muslim community. The assailants merely chose Muslim-like dress as a way to alter their appearances.
I hope the Muslim community, and all other communities across Philadelphia, can work together as we deal with this horrible act of violence. This City needs every one of all faiths, races, and ethnicities to come together in peace. I am calling on the religious community to recognize tomorrow as a day of peace and to pray for Sergeant Liczbinski and his family..
Sincerely,
Michael A. Nutter
UPDATE 05/09/08 6:51AM EST: Umm Zaid has written a good piece on this event here. However, I must say that I stand with the Germantown Masjid’s decision to not perform the funeral. Justification for such a stance is given here
UPDATE 05/09/08 6:28AM EST: Watch news cast here
—
The Muslim Community in Germantown and other Muslim communities in Philadelphia have decided that they will have no part in the funeral of a man that was killed robbing a bank and killing police officer Sgt. Stephen Liczbinski in the process. I have gotten emails and inquires wondering if these thugs were Muslim. The sad answer: At least one was
Story is below
The leadership of the Germantown Masjid has refused to conduct funeral services for Howard Cain, the bank robber who killed Sgt. Stephen Liczbinski with a Chinese-made semi-automatic rifle.
“No, we will not bury him at Germantown Masjid,” said Tariq El Shabazz, managing director of the mosque. “We don’t want one slight scintilla hinting that we condone his behavior.”
On Sunday evening, a friend of Cain’s family asked if Cain’s burial could take place at the mosque on Germantown Avenue near Logan Street, El Shabazz said.
El Shabazz declined to conduct the service after researching Islamic law and meeting with Saadiq Abdul Jabbar, chief executive of the mosque; Imam Talib Abdullah, and others.
“We don’t tolerate that kind of behavior,” El Shabazz said. “Their actions are not from Islam. You don’t dress like a woman, you don’t rob people or transgress against them or commit murder. On all three grounds, they are dead wrong.
“We are not saying that Muslims should not bury him, or that he should not have Janaza [funeral prayers],” he added. “He is a Muslim and he has that right, but we don’t want that here.”
The religious leaders offered to “talk the family through the washing of the body and Janaza prayers,” El Shabazz said, “but we didn’t hear anything more from them after we stated our position.”
El Shabazz, who is also a defense attorney, was just as adamant about fugitive Eric Floyd, who was arrested last night.
“That boy needs to . . . answer for what he did,” El Shabazz said.
Since Sunday morning, Imam Abdullah has been preaching five times a day about the officer’s murder.
Abdullah “is rough on his own people,” Jabbar said. “He’s an elder in the mosque, a religious teacher who has stature and he makes you feel the wrath of Allah.”
At Friday’s Jumah prayers, “Abdullah is going to deliver a very strong message about that kind of behavior, and take the position that the Muslim community has to stand against something like this,” said Jabbar, referring to the killing of a police officer.
“You have to be clear and come out against them, even if they are in your flock,” he added.
Asked if the burial service would take place at the Philadelphia Masjid, at 47th Street and Wyalusing Avenue, a source said: “I’m telling you now. We ain’t burying him here.” *
Filed under: Black American Muslims, Convert Issues, The Culture of Denial and Pretense
ASA Br. Tariq
This my repost from brother Umar’s blog
When you look at this
http://www.nbc10.com/slideshow/16194712/detail.html?taf=phi
The repercusions to the Sisters was my first thought , my second was, were these even Muslim brothers? Well apparently at least one of them was http://www.nbc10.com/news/16197309/detail.html
although I
Wow. That’s what you call power. The power to deny a janaza. SubhanAllah!
I think there is also some blame on the shoulders of the Muslim leadership in Philly for years a lot of those Masajid have been built on donations coming from brothers involved in illegal activity now when it’s politically expeidient they renounce them. I am not saying this is the case with the Germantown Masjid or the leadership there but in general the community has in the past looked the other way when it comes to crime.
Unfortunately he did something that was wrong but it does not take him outside of Islam. While, I can understand the political climate it doesn’t supercede his right to be buried as a Muslim. Who will bury the brother then? Who has stepped up?
The burden falls upons all Muslims technically since he was Muslim (yes Muslims do bad things) but mostly upon those whom he followed and prayed with so the question is which Masjid did he attend?
Isnt the duty of the Imam to lead the janazah?
I have mixed feelings about this issue.
I would never condone the violent actions of Howard Cain and his cohorts. What they did to Officer Liczbinski was awful and they should receive the punishment that fits the crime. While nobody is saying that he Imam El-Shabazz shouldn’t be disgusted by the crime and his now deceased subject, he was a member of that masjid. It’s only fair that Imam El- Shabazz conduct his Janazah. I’m curious? What would have happened if he( the imam) would have learned about Cain’s character after the fact? In addition to that, there could be many more brother/sisters at that masjid and other masajid who could potentially be a Howard Cain in disguise.
@ Rasheed Moore
You are 100% correct and no one wants to say it. The ranks of the salafis in Philly are filled with thieves, rapists, and drug dealers, but they look the other way because the brother is “upon the manhaj”
Last year, three Muslims from the Germantown masjid robbed a Wal-Mart store of $300K
But these same brothers are up in arms when a brother’s pants are too long or beard is too short
As Salaamu Alaikum Brother Rasheed:
You said:
” … for years a lot of those Masajid have been built on donations coming from brothers involved in illegal activity …”
With all due respect brother, what proof do you have for this statement?
This entire incident is a human tragedy on a number of levels. First and foremost, as a Muslim, my condolences go to the family of the murdered officer. Islam certainly does NOT condone, in any way, shape, form or fashion, the actions that resulted in this tragedy. Sadly, and we are commanded to be speak the truth even it is against lourselves, this incident is part of a subculture that has existed in many of our “communities” for far too long. (More on that later).
Having stated that, we cannot throw out the proverbial baby with the bathwater. The fact that the action was a deplorable, hated one does not negate the fact that the man has the right of janaza. This is clear and explicit, and NO amount of “researching Islamic law” and/or meeting with anyone can change that fact. Janaza, proper Islamic burial, is a right that the Muslim, even those involved in such actions, has over us. If SOMEONE in the comunity fulfills this right, the entire community is absolved of the responsibility; and if NO ONE fulfills it, the entire community is in error.
Let’s deal with the FACTS of this matter. The individuals involved in this situation exists within many Muslim communities within “urban America”. Having been born, raised, and still actively engaged in the Muslim community, traveling throughout America, I see, as do many of us, and we can no longer deny it’s existence, reality and the impact it has upon us.
PERSONALLY, not on behalf of any masajid, center or organization, I would have advised the family to have the janaza at whatever funeral home the body was being prepared in (certainly permissable). This would fulfill the right of the janaza and not further involve the local masajid. I know that SOMEONE in the Philadelphia area, and I have MANY relationships thre, would be willing to be responsible for the preparation process and leading the prayer. We’ve seen this happen before even in the case of a murder-suicide!
Lastly, I implore our/my community to take a long, hard look at ourselves, a “collective introspective”, and not just “react” but be proactive in speaking out and isolating the criminal subculture that exists. WE know it when we see it! DON’T take the dirty money, when it’s OBVIOUS that it’s such. The whole “hate it in your heart” position is what has helped get us to this point. We can redeem ourselves and reclaim the dignity of Islam and in the process. We just have to be willing to change ourselves if we want Allah to do as promised and change our condition.
I think Br. Amin hit the nail on the head…
“Lastly, I implore our/my community to take a long, hard look at ourselves, a
Does anyone know if the family has found a place to bury him and someone to help them properly prepare his body if they do need help with that?
As-Salaamu ‘alaikum,
Do they have a basis in Islamic law for refusing a funeral for these men, or are they just doing this to make a statement or to disassociate the masjid from the robbery in the eyes of the public? They should make it clear that they condemn the actions of the robbers (admittedly, people often do not listen to condemnations coming from Muslims against other Muslims), but that janaza is a routine affair and an obligation on the community. Many powerful men, Muslims and others, get religious funerals despite being scoundrels or mass murderers; two petty bank robbers should not be an exception.
There is ample evidence to support the position that the Masjids of Philadelphia have taken.
Abu Dawud narrates that the Prophet ordered that Ma’iz be stoned for adultery. He did not pray over him, yet he did not prohibit anyone else from doing so.
Scholars inferred from this that sinners, especially those that commit major sins or are criminals, should not be prayed over by leaders and people of importance in the community, to send a message to those in the community partaking in such activities that such things will not be tolerated. Criminals, renegades, murderers, and other such people are worse than someone that committed adultery, and as such deserve even less respect.
There is almost consensus on this point with regards to criminals that commit violent crimes and have not repented that Muslim leadership should not pray over them.
The reasoning taken from this Hadith:
Just as this person refused to respect the communal values that a Muslim is to uphold, the Muslim leadership will refuse to acknowledge the person’s actions by praying over them.
Others may well pray over him, but his funeral is not given official sanction by the community leadership, such a person is not deserving of official recognition, even if he/she may deserve a burial.
Most Fiqh texts cover this issue as well as explanations of hadith. Please refer back to the scholars and their books before speaking out of ignorance and desire. it does nothing more that cause more problems at a time when Muslims are in need of repairing their reputation sullied by a few nominally loyal members of the community.
The real question in all of this: Was his MINHAJ correct???
As Salaamu Alaykum
@ H
This hadith singularlly is not enough nor does it reflect ample evidence, for one this is only an excerpt which does not convey the whole situation, which a number of hadith explain don’t piece meal the deen.
This subhaba was given multiple chances to not be stoned, yet refused to accept them could this have been the reason the Prophet did not perform the janazah?
The burden of proof still remains for the leaders of the Masjid to show that Prophet (saws) or any of the Salaf refused to pray janazah explictedly for the sin of murder. I’m not going to even get in to the aspect of the fiqh of qasas for killing a non-Muslim. Just who are these Scholars that carry this oppinion?
Even after Washi accepted Islam the Prophet (saws) still shuned him for killing his uncle Humza in battle prior to his acceptance of Islam so if we use YOUR anology then this would mean that we should then also shun all Muslims for killings they did before they accepted Islam.
Respectfully I say this is why it is important to read the shar of hadith and to understand the full circumstances of a matter. Perhaps you can correct me if I’m in error but doesn’t this Masjid reject this type of qiyas or speculative analogical reasoning?
On another note where is the compassion for this brother’s family or possiblly children?
The Prophet (saw) has told and shown us to respond to our brothers when they right and when they are wrong and neither invovled turing your back.
Now if this Masjid or ANY Masjid wanted make a stance how about shuning those who beat their wives or who do not provide for their families. This would be a stance. This is corrective stances. There is nothing corrective about refusing this brother’s janazah
Allahu Alim
I know this doesn’t matter to most of the masajid in Philly, but in the Hanafi madhhab someone killed in the act of banditry, robbery, or rebellion is given neither ghusl or janaza. In other situations, the funeral is the primary responsibility (and right) of the family - although participating in it is wajib for anyone aware of it. Funerals should not be held in the (shar`i) masjid portion of a “masjid” (i.e. Muslim community center) as it is. I think the suggestion of having the funeral quietly in the funeral home is a good one - because there is no need for these centers to be dragged further into this. However, I wonder what the policy of these same masajid is regarding those killed in lower profile crimes, which can not be too rare in Philly these days.
[...] is not new anymore. I have been hearing about it on NPR for the whole week. Tariq talked about it here. Fortunately, NPR hasn’t made it a point to tell us about the “Muslim connection” [...]
As-Salaamu ‘Alaikum,
Abu Usamah and H,
As was stated in the hadeeth, there is a basis for the LEADERSHIP not to pray over someone who has committed a heinous crime to send the strong message that it was a major sin. However, to forbid the entire body of Muslims from praying over the body of a Muslim is what has NOT been proven. The congregation is in the bind of having to support its leadership and the leadership, which has a congregation composed of ex-cons and others, has clearly felt the need to take the step to distance themselves and Islam from criminality. I believe they have gone too far because of the lack of evidence to refuse the burial of a Muslim. The imam stated it himself that it is the man’s right to be buried as a Muslim.
Secondly however, those who have made comments alluding to the backgrounds of members of the masjid to generalize and take a slap at the masjid should fear Allah and stop. It is the one of the outstanding features of Islam that it has the ability to transform the worst of people who committed the worst crimes - but it does not always happen. If you condemn those men who have accepted the deen after having committed those crimes then think of the atrocities and harm that the likes of Umar Ibnul-Khattab or Hamza or Khalid ibn Walid inflicted upon Muslims before their conversions! If you condemn them in general then ask yourself what YOU or YOUR masjid has done to help people who come out of situations of crime, abuse, dysfunction etc. to develop themselves after becoming Muslim or to become productive citizens after being incarcerated. Perhaps you do not know what such brothers (and sisters) face being turned down from job after job, no money, unable to go to school etc.
What kind of Muslims are we to be so arrogant as to think there are none with serious issues amongst us? Any major sin committed by ANY Muslim is a sorry reflection on us all. MANHAJ is obviously incomplete or shortcoming in ANY such individual.
The implication of the insinuations being made by some commentators here is that there is little hope for any Muslim to change, and that repentance, redemption, forgiveness or acceptance is hardly possible or forthcoming. How sad. It exactly reflects the attitude of the worshipper who told the man who killed 99 there was no forgiveness or repentance for him, so he became his 100th victim! This attitude is as bad as the one that denies other Muslims to give another Muslim his or her right to be prayed over and buried and asked for forgiveness for with Allah. THE PROPHET DID NOT DO THAT.
It certainly DOES feed the cycle such flawed brothers or sisters face. No chance with society, no chance with the Muslims either. Allahul-Musta’aan!
Since ‘guilt by association’ is the mantra of many there in Germantown, it only stands to reason that they would take this position since if others apply the same logic on them as they do to others, they would of course naturally all be guilty of condoning the criminal actions of the deceased. Well, it may be news to them, but this blog and others prove that it is already too late!
Aren’t ALL of us as MUSLIMS in the same boat in the eyes of non-Muslims who judge the group based on actions of the few? Tariq would naturally support the Germantown position since it is fully consistent with his condemnation of Muslim terrorists and not wanting to be associated with them or them with Islam. Again, it is too late there as well.
Muslim thugs, Muslim terrorists, Muslim drinkers, Muslim adulterers, Muslim liars, cheats, abusers, drug addicts, pimps, embezzlers, oppressors…you name it; but NONE of that is ISLAMIC now is it!? Does anyone out there think that such people will NOT exist among this ummah?
Let the jerk bury himself.
He obviously had no love for Muslims to begin with. A NIQAB???!!!
Bastard.
Like my friend Fatimah always said “I didn’t see him take his shahada, prove it to me”
I agree with Tariq on this on.
As salamu ‘alaikum,
Masha Allah - when will the Muslims learn. I disgree with the decision to not bury this brothers.
How do the positions of the fuqaha stand-up in a situation where Muslims are in a minority status? The masajid are - in most cases - collectively struggle to bury a person. Let alone leaving the entire responsibility on the family or a handful of people. Whereas in the Muslim lands there is surely someone with the time, skills and resources to bury the deceased. Probably provided and made easy by the fact that are burial grounds and people that know how to properly handle the situation outside of the leaders.
The avergage Muslim here can’t recite Al-Fatiha correctly let alone give this brother the proper burial. This is common sense and Muslim needs to stop being so insecure with regards to non-Muslims and what they think and care to the extent that we don’t even look after our own.
Is this to say that we are setting a new ‘American’ standard? Will every criminal Muslim be denied their rights?
We are not a religion of guilt by association. The masjid and it’s members are not the perpetrators of the crime. Even the non-Muslims will honor the rights of their criminals in death.
This is just another case of having mixed-up priorities. May Allah (swt) guides us and have mercy upon us.
Let me say that I DO UNDERSTAND the position of the Germantown imam. If he did not distance himself and the masjid from the killer WHAT image indeed would the people of Philadelphia have of the Muslims as a whole and that masjid in particular? A couple of people have already stated what they see that community comprised of. So in one fell swoop his action
1. Distances the Muslims from the detestable acts of the criminals
2. Protects the community he is responsible for from possible reprisals from a population already on edge and this includes the police
3. Sends a very powerful message to ANYONE else in that community about what the Muslims think of brothers or sisters who would do what the criminals did and as such act as an additional deterrent if some, like them, have not yet grown enough Islamically.
4. Demonstrates that everyone who is black, wears a short thobe, black abaya or niqaab, is NOT to be confused or assumed a criminal any more than every Christian who buries a gang-banger, drug addict, pimp or whatever is to be considered as condoning such behavior and just as anyone one who does is considered ignorant and racist should be considered the same when it comes to Muslims.
SO, while I do not fully agree with the action of the masjid leadership, I certainly understand it. I can’t wait to see the coverage of today’s khutbah and read the transcript. May Allah grant the imam the ability to communicate well and correctly, ameen.
I will post what I put on another site about this:
I understand where you are coming from and your frustration. I just worry about where it ends when we decide who can and who cannot be given a Muslim burial and prayers.
I think I am a pretty decent guy as it stands right now. I got into a lot of trouble as a teenager, but I havent been arrested since I was 19, so that is almost 20 years of clean living.
I have a lot of tattoos and dont look like a typical Muslim. Maybe someone would deny me janaza because they think that I somehow would bring the mosque or Islam into disrepute?
I recognise that one day I will be laid out and I will be washed. What will they think when they see my tattoos? Will they look down on my widow or my children?
I am all for cleaning up mosques and Islamic communities. It is the state of the situation now that keeps me from being a part of the local Muslim community here or allowing my family to participate in it.
However, when someone is dead they loose the right to appeal to anyone but God, they cannot stand up to explain themselves or to rebutt accusations made against them.
By all means, generate a process by which, with due process, people can be removed from mosques and Muslim associations, but due process is NOT possible for a dead person.
There, but through the grace of God, we go.
I could die tomorrow, would I be denied prayers because of what people thought my past, or even my present, was?
If they decide not to bury this guy because of what happened and how it will look, they could just as easily NOT say prayers for me, or bury me because of my past, the way I looked, or whatever justification they could come up to.
We are MUSLIMS, as the man is dead, we should leave it up to God!
The murder of a Philadelphia police officer by what appears to be Muslims, while dressed in Muslim woman
As salamu ‘alaikum Abu Abdillah:
What you wrote is exactly what scares me in this new approach and idea of ‘distancing’ that Muslims are coming with. I would consider it an extreme where Muslims allow external ‘politics’ define how they practice Islam. What we can practice of Shariah we are going to throw away?
This idea also plays into the issue of ‘moral high-ground’ as a dawah/political platform. I consider that a slippery slope indeed. We call to Allah (swt) and His beloved Prophet (saw) not so the actions of the Muslims. This incident only tipifies the state that the Muslims are in. We have no room for faking the moral high ground.
The Muslims of Germantown should already have a record with the community in regards to their stance on crimes and it does not implicate them as being pro-crime by burying a Muslim who unfortunately committed a crimes. Really, it demonstrates that Muslims are in bad shape. It demonstrates that Muslims are human too and we have criminals in our midst like everyone else. What differentiates the Muslim is that he deals with the issue in a just manner. Are we even going a step further than the non-Muslims in that we won’t even bury our own dead now?
We hate the crime and decry it but we don’t hate the person and deny them their rights. We also don’t fear the blame of the blamers but we should be balanced in our relations with the non-Muslims. We can’t be so overly concerned about what they say or what they think that we throw away the bits of our law that we can practice in this country. What kind of statement is that? To add insult to injury is the idea of “we’ll walk the family through the procedures”. Huh? So we are doing janazah by proxy now?
This is a sad occassion. Both for the criminal act that has been committed by the actual criminals and the ‘attitude of distancing’ that represents a new extreme for Muslims in this country.
May Allah guide us and have mercy upon us…
Do most of you even read the posts and watch the links before commenting? Or are you to busy trying to make yourselves heard?
Shabazz in the video links provided says “We do not condone this type of behavior. Islam is perfect, Humans are not.”
Secondly, Accepting singular hadith for used in belief and ahkam is the position of ahl al sunnah wa al-jama’ah.
Please do not bring handbags full of sophistry to the discussion.
Unless you are qualified to speak on these matters, do not argue over them.
As Salaamu Alaykum, Imam Luqman Ahmad,
Though I’m not convince this is correct, as you are are truly one of the Scholars here in the west I will defer to your wisdom, and cease and desist in arguing on this matter in cyber court. As The Prophet (saws) said “Verily the Imam is a shield”
I thought it was extreme that there is a Masjid here my city where the Imam dosen’t allow anyone in the Masjid without a police clearance (to be fair he does reimburse the cost if you are clear ), but this is a whole other another level all I can say is that this is a serious precedent. mashaAllah
InshaAllah I’ll be in Philly in November perhaps by then there will be clearity.
May Allah grant the indigenous Imams strength in the efforts to guide us and shield us Ameen
I don’t blog, but I ran into this while looking up news. Damn the Internet is a waste of life and time. You got fake scholars on the internet blogging like it will make a difference in the world - lol.
Get your FACE out of your computer screens and go OUTSIDE and help out your local community.
I am sure everyone will agree that, Alhumdulilah, most of the people will never be Alim’s - we are common people who are aware of very fundamental and common hadith. If you were to pick one value or moral in our deen, and try to perfect it, it will take you months or years -
Start doing what you know you are supposed to do - and stop bickering over technical matters which we have RESERVED our Imams to deal with. You got a problem with his decision, kick him out - don’t bicker like little babies or gossiping women on internet blogs and waste your time.
I’m sure many of you don’t even respect your mothers and fathers like your supposed to. So instead of wasting time on this blog, why don’t you get your fat, lazy, self-centered behind’s up, and go help your mother take care of her chores or talk with her or help your father with something. Or talk to your neighbor. Or feed the homeless. Knowledge is not just knowing 1000 hadith and the way one is more authentic than the other. It is having fear of Allah. So instead of wasting your time discussing things that might be trivial or very complicated, deal with things that are clear to EVERYONE.
While at the same time, accumulate your knowledge but keep your mouth shut until you FULLY understand something.
A very, very wise REAL Alim once told me that a person who repeats what he hears without FULLY understanding it has characteristics of a liar. He didn’t say that the person was lying - but he said that it was indication that he was one. How many of us do this on a daily basis? Lets stop being the liars that we were brainwashed to be in this country and take a step towards REAL knowledge - to save ourselves before we die.
Asalamy Alaykum!
Salaam ‘Alaikum
//While at the same time, accumulate your knowledge but keep your mouth shut until you FULLY understand something.//
Maybe you should heed your own advice before you slam and name call the people participating in this thread. I know several of them to be quite active not only in their communities, but towards their own families. Besides, didn’t you just engage in the very behavior you are decrying?
BismillaharRahmanirRahim
salam alaykum! Allah Allah, this is becoming a hot item. Why? I’m wondering what will come out of a discussion of this item… on the internet. Just wondering.
-Saifuddin
A Salaamu Alaikum,
Well so much has been said already that I won’t be repetitive. I pretty much agree with just about everything Umm Zaid has said. While I too am no faqhi I know of no basis for denial of the janaza. The ‘evidence’ presented by the Abu Dawud hadith unfortunately underscores why you don’t equate a hadith with a ruling. You follow Quran and Sunnah which INCLUDES ahadith, qiyas, maslahah, urf, ijtihad and other sciences which together will give you a proper, holistic and truly ’salafi’ (i.e. the real meaning of the term not what some today have appropriated for themselves) understanding of how you approach Islam from a legalistic point of view. We use these books of hadith in ways that they were NOT meant to be used. Imam Bukhari himself in the commentary for his manuscript stated that it was meant to give the average Muslim (average of his day is of course no where near the average of our day unfortunately) a greater appreciation for hadiths. But Sahih Al-Bukhari was never meant as a fiqh manual. You don’t use it to issue rulings. If Imam Bukhari himself didn’t follow his own Sahih for rulings (he actually followed Shafi fiqh) isn’t it amazing that Muslims with usually not even a rudimentary understanding of the Arabic alphabet take from it to issue rulings? Now I and many others have cautioned for years about doing this and we see the detrimental effects in our communities. Umm Zaid mentioned it when she talked about pat on the back congratulations for beard lengths, niqaabs, high water pants and serial monogamy (marry-divorce-marry-divorce). Meanwhile those things that Islam really came to address i.e. the spiritual imperative get subsumed under a brand of Islam with roots in the political beginnings of modern Saudi Arabia and not one that truly addresses with love and respect the unique socio-cultural realities of in this case urban African-American Islam. Sorry I know that was a mouthful. So one of the things this highlights is a need for Muslims, especially those of us who are converts in the inner cities, to learn traditional Islamic scholarship. We are doing all sorts of things based on either our reading of a hadith (in English) or someone else’s reading who is not constructing a fatwa (which traditionally is issued to an individual on a case by case basis by the way) for a situation in Germantown, Philadelphia in Spring 2008 but instead someone who is basing their ‘ruling’ coming from their own background or worse people who have learned from them. This is not to impugn all information/knowledge from a particular country overseas but it is to say that we need to have some perspective and understanding of how our fiqh works and why it is so dynamic and so beneficial to everyone for all places and all times. It is because it immerses itself in a person’s place, time and culture but with Islamic underpinnings.
Salaam alaikum Saifuddin,
I am wondering what will come out of your question? Just wondering.
Howard Cain may have committed a very boneheaded act and possibly he may have put the Philly Muslim community( and possibly everybody else’s Muslim community for that matter) in jeopardy, but with some people it doesn’t matter how matter the imam or other members of the community will distance themselves from Cain. If people going to dislike you, most likely their minds about the Muslim faith was made up way before the death of Officier Liczbinski and will continue to harbor these negative attitudes after him.Unfortunately, that is a part of our screwed up world.
Open minded( and/or god fearing) people will think the opposite. Howard Cain and other like him will not/cannot take their positive thoughts about it. As a non-Muslim, Howard Cain hasn’t took away my positive thoughts about the Muslim faith.
BismillaharRahmanirRahim
asalaamu ‘alaykum! Brother Dash you wrote,
I agree, it would be most beneficial to the overall culture of the American Muslim if the efforts were more centered around the way of traditional learning. Though it is understood that everyone cannot be a scholar, it is also understood that, the traditional methods of faith and practice in Islam include the average Muslim associating with those holy saints, wise shaykhs and righteous scholars. This is what Shaykh Abdullah Adhami was also discussing in the first issue of your new ChaiPod cast Brother Dash (hey that rhymed). May Allah Almighty lead us to and keep us on the straight way, amin.
wa ‘alaykum asalaam wa rahmatullah Margari Aziza Hill
-Saifuddin
This event in Philly is very unfortunate. However, I think the real issue here that is being lost are all the social/psychological issues that are still going unaddressed. Unaddressed within the varying Muslim communities; depression, low self-esteem, bi-polar and anger management are still alive and well within the Blackamerican Muslim community. Not only is it within the Blackamerican Muslim community but some of the very leadership of these communities suffer from some of the aforementioned issues. Until we utilize Islam as a way to deal with these ills I fear we will have same results as we have the last ten years. We need to become solution oriented with our Islam. Devising and creating solutions from an Islamic perspective. We tell brothers not to go to Morocco to marry a second, but we offer no solution for a large part of our community that became monogamous after in most cases 15 plus years of the opposite. We tell our children not to be like the non-Muslims, however in some cases we provide them no legitimate solution to a society that is a struggle for us as parents to even deal with let alone a child. We ask sisters to be mothers first, but offer no resources and help on how to make this job easier; keeping in mind that a large portion of the Blackamerican Muslim males don’t make beyond 50 grand a year. We tell our wives to be submissive and subservient and yet send them out into a work force that would eat them alive with such a demeanor in the name of maximizing finances.
In large part we need an over haul. We have to take personal ownership of our Islam. No longer and can we practice based on the way everyone else practices or practiced (Salaf). We have to now personalize our practice, understand our on personal shortcomings and utilizing the examples of the Prophet and the Salaf as a set of guidelines. Take OWNERSHIP of your Islam. Become solution oriented, not reactionary. Islam is the solution, we are at a point now where we have to find the how!
@Salafi Burnout:
ALL the Masaajid in Philly have criminals in their ranks, not just the Salafis.
As Salaamu Alaykum Wa Rahmatullahi Wa Barakatahu:
I pray this message reaches you in the Highest of Iman and Best of Health. Something is weighing heavily on my heart and I need to address it:
I live in Delaware and the next major city is Philadelphia. I woke up this morning and watched the news. There was a police officer killed in Philadelphia, earlier this week. (As I’m sure most of you living in Philly know)
I was saddened to hear about the loss of this police officer. Today was the funeral. This officer left behind children and a wife. Now, I was effected by this because I myself, once thought of becoming a police officer and every time I hear about the death of “one of the boys in blue”, I thank Allah that I didn’t choose that as my career path.
But, I was more outraged to hear one of the suspects in the shooting of this officer was a Muslim… (Like we as Muslims don’t have enough problems without adding on cop-killers to our list of names…) SubhanAllah.
Yet, I am more outraged to hear the “Director” of the Germantown Masjid, on television, in a suit and tie stating: …”that we as Muslims condemn acts of violence. That we don’t advocate killings and that we won’t bury this brother…”
Now: MashaAllah, we are Muslims and we are not VIOLENT people. But I have some grave concerns regarding this matter:
1. Aren’t we the same Ummah that is suppose to give our sisters and brothers 70 excuses? I guess we ran out once the TV camera was on… (Why weren’t we making excuses for this deceased brother?)
2. Being that there were other suspects in this case, how do we know the deceased brother is the one that actually killed the officer? Are we going based on what the police are telling us? Based on what we think happened? Aren’t we suppose to have two MUSLIM witnesses for actions?
3. While it is not a personal obligation to bury this Muslim, it is a communal obligation! This masjid is going public in letting the world know- “He ain’t one of us!” Now they are refusing to bury this brother yet, when did we as Muslims decide not to bury another because he or she is sinful? What about me? What about you? So where do you draw the line? I’m not gonna bury Sister X because hey she commited zina… I’m not gonna bury brother Y because I heard he was the meanest of mean! Did we as Muslims refuse to bury Saddam Hussein? Did we refuse to bury other “bad men” accused of far more horrific crimes? NO! Further more, why did we need to go on national tv and let it be known WE AIN’T BURYING THIS MAN?!?!
Now, that being said: How do we give Dawah to the Non-Muslims after something like this? How do we answer the questions from our families when they ask us things like: Wow if the Muslims won’t bury him, who will?
Don’t get me wrong. It sickens me deeply to even think that a Muslim may be guilty of taking the life of a person. It’s not right and it’s not acceptable and it’s not what our Deen teaches.
Ya Muslimeen! But we must support one another. We must band together. IF this brother was guilty of killing this cop, his status is with ALLAH and we must not judge and should pray that ALLAH forgives him.
IF this brother was not guilty, we too must be ask for ALLAH’s FORGIVENESS and MERCY. Our job description as Muslims isn’t to play judge, jury and executioner especially in matters not pertaining to Shariah and without PROOF.
It is possible that I am wrong or may be misinformed. I ask Allah to forgive me if I have wronged anyone.
As Salaam Alaykum:
A’isha Latifah Amatullah
This ain’t the only time men have donned the garb of the Muslimah, and committed crimes. There has been a crime wave in Philly over the past two years where people were doing this, and I don’t recall any of these crimes committed by disbelievers. In one instance a Muslimah was involved.
The brothers and sisters from the “Black folks in America” tribe need to stop being criminals. This is Islaam so no one can use the “the man is keeping down” excuse for this. Allaah freed us from this.
Wow, just Wow.
May Allah (swt) guide us all. I truly believe that we have to come together and learn to work with one another good and bad. Let’s stop letting others define who we are by proxy. When you let others do that, they will undervalue, marginalize, and define you to yourself.
Let’s stop being so quick to judgment and remember to have compassion even in our sickness.
Assalaamu alaikum- Brothers and Sisters, this note is particularly for the Imamate: We need you to impart the spiritual nature of this deen in a manner that best benefits our souls. You are the custodians of the salaat and parlayers of the messages of the Prophets (peace be upon them all). Let you, who is without sin cast the first stone. Imams, you are best aware of our defects and we need your counsel not only in the areas of fiqh but in the daily struggles of life (i.e. forgiveness). Too often you place yourselves on the top shelf along with the Prophets (peace be upon them all) when we need you to be down to earth in the counsel of our daily struggles (fairness). We have aids, addiction, dereliction and transgressions and just as we pray for you-pray for us. As our leaders, do not be afraid of interfaith dialogue,esp. in times of peace. Knowledge alone suffices us not. Be not afraid to change the course of your own actions and embrace others who are lost, hurting and alone-muslim or not. We are (all) your community. Your task is daunting and we appreciate and applaud you. We stand behind you not only in salaat, but will do so, God willing at your own janaza. In America, we are all innocent, until proven guilty… Our prayers of peace extend to the victims, perpetrators and those loved ones who are left behind. Please remember to guard your own modesty, tend to your own flock and to be just esp. in matters of condolences, government and gain. And may Allah’s mercy be sufficient for us all. Ameen.
We have truly became misguided and way off the path of
true Islam. May AllahTa’ala reward the brothers at the
Masjid who had the courage to stand up and do what was
right even if it was against their ownselves and didn’t fit well
with the masses. How can muslims rationalize this unjustified
killing by saying we all commit sin and so, on and so.
I would encourage the muslims to read, for when you read
you gain knowledge and comprehension skills. If you were
reading books about Islam, it would be known that sins
carry different levels of punishments and we are place in
different levels of the hell fire if Allah Ta’ala decrees that hell
be our abode based on the types and levels of our sins. If
this brother had done this act in an Islamic country the
shariah ruling would have been pronouced and carried out
and it would have been a done deal. We have to start
standing up for what is right and forbidding what is wrong.
Instead of division the muslims should learn to pull together
and get on the same page (Islam, Sunnah). In closing Allah
Ta’ala forgives whom he wills of all sins except shirk but
we still receive the punishment do we not. Does the Quran
tells us that every sole shall taste what it has earned.
[...] Deeny about the Germantown Muslim Community in Philadelphia in the aftermath of the Howard Cain burial controversy (Thanks to Br. [...]
Preserving outward unity is very important. Kaffirs are reading this, too, you know.
I will keep the muslims in Philly in my prayers.
Salaam
Salam Aleykum
Please i have problem i want to know if its halal or not
to celebrate every year after somebody died
during celebration we have quran recitation, dua for deceased persons.
please i want answer
Nassoro Ally
FIRST AND FOREMOST, IF THE SISTER ASK TO HAVE A JANAZAH PERFORM, OBVIOUSLY, HE WAS MUSLIM! (THINK BEST OF THE MUSLIM) (WANT FOR YOUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS WHAT YOU WANT FOR YOURSELF!). SECONDLY, WHO ARE WE TO JUDGE? ARE YOU ALLAH (SWA)? NO, NO, NO! EVERYONES ENTITLED TO THEIR FEELINGS, BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, IT’S ALLAH (SWA) WHO WILL BE DOING THE JUDGING. IT’S ALLAH (SWA) WRATH HE WILL FEEL (IF ANY). ALLAH CAN SEND THE MOST PIOUS MAN TO THE HELL FIRE AND VICE VERSA! SO WHO ARE WE TO JUDGE? THIRDLY, I ‘M PRETTY SURE JANAZAH’S BEEN DONE ON MUSLIMS THAT DID WORSE THINGS THEN THAT! YOU’LL BURRIED DRUG DEALERS(MUSLIMS) WARING BEEF OVER DRUGS MUSLIMS KILLING MUSLIMS (SO WHO ARE WE TO JUDGE?) A MUSLIM THAT KILLED ANOTHER MUSLIM GETS A JANAZAH, BUT A MUSLIM KILLING A KUFR DOES’NT? DON’T GET ME WRONG, I’M NOT SAYING IT’S OKAY, AGAIN, I’M NOT THE JUDGE OF THAT, BUT COME ON MUSLIMS! FOURTHLY, WE DON’T NEED TO BE ASHAMED OF WHAT ARE MUSLIM BROTHER DID, WE ALL SIN EVERYDAY WETHER SEEN, UNSEEN, EXTREME, NOT EXETREME AND ALLAH (SWA) KNOWS BEST! LIKE SOMEONE MENTIONED:MASJIDS ARE BUILD THROUGH FUNDS, AND NOT ALL FUNDS GIVING ARE HALAL! AND ALLAH KNOWS BEST! HOW WAS G-TOWN MASJID ACCOMPLISHED? WAS IT DONE THROUGH GOOD DEEDS AND ACTS OF WORSHIP? WILL ALLAH ACCEPT WHAT HAPPENED? NO HARM, BUT KEEP IT REAL!!!!!!!!!! BUT WE WANT TO JUDGE THIS BROTHER. LASTLY, THERE ARE RIGHT WE HAVE OVER ONE ANOTHER AND FOLLOWING THE FUNERAL IS ONE OF THEM. THE MUSLIM COMMUNITY SHOULD HAVE MADE SURE THAT BROTHER HAD A PROPER JANAZAH. IT IS ON THE WHOLE MUSLIM COMMUNITY OR SOMEONE IN THE MUSLIM COMMUNITY TO MAKE SURE IT GETS DONE. IF THIS BROTHER WAS MUSLIM, THE WIFE SAID HE WAS A MUSLIM, THEN WHY DID’NT IT GET DONE? WHO CARES ABOUT THE MEDIA, WHO CARE ABOUT BEING PUT ON THE SPOT LIGHT? “THAT IS OUR BROTHER IN ISLAM AND NO MASJID SHOULD HAVE DENIED HIM HIS RIGHTS! BOTTOM LINE! INSHA-ALLAH, MY INTENTIONS IS NOT TO OFFEND ANY ONE IN ANY WAY.
“FIRST AND FOREMOST, IF THE SISTER ASK TO HAVE A JANAZAH PERFORM, OBVIOUSLY, HE WAS MUSLIM! (THINK BEST OF THE MUSLIM) (WANT FOR YOUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS WHAT YOU WANT FOR YOURSELF!). SECONDLY, WHO ARE WE TO JUDGE? ARE YOU ALLAH (SWA)? NO, NO, NO! EVERYONES ENTITLED TO THEIR FEELINGS, BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, IT’S ALLAH (SWA) WHO WILL BE DOING THE JUDGING….”
You sound like a christian!!! These statements are false!!!
He was a freakin criminal!!!!!!! So germantown commands the good and forbids the evil for once.(even though they have in the past) The brother’s wife rahimahulaah , got on the radio with some brothers and starting saying nothing but ignorance on a MUSIC radio station of all places. Daud is right.You sound like a christian!!! These statements are false!!!
As little sympathy as I have for such a person, it does present a dilemma, even if “only” from a legal standpoint. I think the major masajid in Bombay, India, did the same thing in reaction to the terrorist attacks there last year (though their case was more drastic, since the people involved were responsible for “India’s 9/11″) . Classical scholars didn’t have to worry about the devastating effects of PR like this in an interconnected world where Muslims are being put under a microscope.
the ruling came from classical scholars….loooooool
YA ALLAH I AM FROM PHILLY, BUT I DON’T LIVE THERE ANY MORE. PLEASE MY BROTHERS’ AND SISTERS’ DO THE RESEARCH AS YOU WOULD DO WITH ANY OTHER DELIMA WE MAY HAVE. I READ EVERY ONE’S RESPONSE AND WAS HORRIFIED. I CAN’T SAY I KNOW EXACTLY WHAT TO DO, BUT I WILL SAY PRAY ON IT AND BEG ALLAH(SWT) FOR FORGIVNESS IF ANY PERSONS WERE WRONG ABOUT BURRING THE BROTHER. THE STATE OF THE MUSLIMS BOTHERS ME SO MUCH. MAY ALLAH HAVE MERCY ON ALL OF US.
Give me the procedure on how to BURY Muslim corpse with evidences from Hadiths and holy Quran