Is There a Need For Black History Month?
Posted on February 4th, 2009 by Tariq Nelson
Now that black American history IS American history, some are arguing that it needs to end. I tend to agree…
But this year’s Black History Month will be different, taking place as it does against a backdrop of unprecedented change in the national leadership. As the events of the last month have convincingly shown, there’s no separating the current fortunes and histories of 37 million African Americans from the rest of the America.
When black American history intertwines so completely with American history in general, what’s the rationale for separating them?
Read it all
Filed under: History
When did it intertwine with American history? So will American history then start in 2008 or 2009?
People calling for end to Black History month are just jumping the gun. When we see it so entwined with American History then there will be no need. I haven’t seen proof of that being anywhere near to being true.
Morgan Freeman on Race and Black History Month:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=FO214IFRW1M
Black history is not something that Muslims should concern themselves with. Islaamic history should be our concern, especially since we’re so ignorant of the Deen. The Seerah of the Prophet is something that we can benefit from because it can help us get to Jennah. Can you say the same about black history? The answer is no! If some one can bring something from black history that will help us get to Jennah, and save us from the Hell-Fire, then bring it!!!
Black History Month should never end–at least until the American people will accept it as part of it.
Obama may have made history, but there are people in this world , including some members of our own community who don’t know much or anything about their past. If they do, it seems to always be about the big wigs of Black history opposed to the lesser known ones who also made major impacts in it. I just wouldn’t want kids to think that Black History started with Martin Luther King and ended with Obama. Seemingly these days, that is what what is being taught.
“Black history is not something that Muslims should concern themselves with. Islaamic history should be our concern, especially since we’re so ignorant of the Deen. The Seerah of the Prophet is something that we can benefit from because it can help us get to Jennah. Can you say the same about black history? The answer is no! If some one can bring something from black history that will help us get to Jennah, and save us from the Hell-Fire, then bring it!!!”
This sort of thinking is what sets Muslims back. How do we expect for people to accept us when we wouldn’t even bother learning about them?!
On top of that Daud, you should recognize that “Islamic History” is PURELY based on people’s stories/experiences/etc. Just like “black history and any other sort of “history”, there are bound to be flaws in these accounts of “what happened”.
salaam
@ yummyme
All I can do is just shake my head at the ignorance of the Muslims, and particularly at how easily many are willing to speak about the Deen, despite their ignorance. You need to learn a little about the science of hadith, the isnaad and how the Qur’an, Ahadith, and Seerah was transmitted. If you knew anything about that, you would not have made the comments you made above.
I don’t want to hear anyone talk a bunch of smack. The open challenge is to bring one thing from black history that will get us to Paradise, or save us from the Hell-Fire. Bring it!
@ Daud
No one here has made such a claim. Get a life
I whole-hearthedly agree that this notion of Black history month should be brought to an end, because why should learning about one’s history be religated and marginalized to one month.
No every day should be a day of learning ones seera no matter which ethinic group you belong.
Allah revealed stories of both the non-Muslims and Muslims in the Quran to serve as both a warning and to strengthen the Muslims. Specifically Allah revealed the narratives of the Rasuls to strengthen. Also, the history of the non-Muslim grandparents and parents of the Prophet saws were preserved. Further there are a number of hadith where the Prophet (saws) approved of the cultural habits that were not revealed beforehand.
@Daud preserving the history of one’s lineage and progeny is essential to the preserving the deen. Had you actually studied with a scholar you would have been correctly informed of concepts qawaid and maslaha. Instead of those of your ilk use maslaha as an excuse to grovel at the feet of corupt rulers who twist the deen like a sailor does rope.
for your own soul hurry and complete your studies and obtain your degree from the kafr so that you can go to the land of your scholars, stop spewing your ignorance. Yes, you do make some good points at times when people post questionable statements on tawheed, I will give you that, but otherwise its just one statment of “strawman” ignorance after the other. You are like a punch drunk boxer aimlessly swinging.
“I don’t want to hear anyone talk a bunch of smack. The open challenge is to bring one thing from black history that will get us to Paradise, or save us from the Hell-Fire. Bring it!”
@Daud,
Have you looked at the relationship between self-confidence and sins? There are emotional sides to all people, most of these emotional aspects are appeased in some form by understanding who you are in relation to those like you. Case in point, if we as Muslims no matter the color can look back on our different heritages understanding the struggles, while empathizing with their ignorance we should be able to at that point develop an even more solid relationship with our Lord Allah, and be ever more grateful for his guidance. So there is your evidence how studying your past can help you get closer to Allah and thus help you on the last day.
I have read your hard and harsh responses many times over, and remind you that of the signs of the people of knowledge and even the students is that they become easier on the people, based on the knowledge that they have. When we look back at our scholars we find them always easy first. Try applying ease to your approach, and then be patient, and you’ll see that with ease and patience the results speak for themselves.
Here is an example, the Khateeb at a local Masjid calls to the Quran and Sunnah as understood by the salaf every Jumuah and time in between. However he has never told brothers to raise their pants legs above there ankles or told brothers that they must have beards. Nor has he told sisters that don’t cover that they must. Now these same individuals made the choices on their own to do these things, more brothers with beards and pants above their ankles and sisters in hijaab. As they are now making decisions based on their choice to get closer to Allah, and not because of someone hitting them over their about something that they are not ready for. These are all outward aspects of belief, but do not forget that our belief is both inner and outward. So your outward actions are a reflection of what is going on in the inside, so if we deal with the inside then the outside will follow.
Remember ease is first not hardship in the religion. We are easy first then hard or harsh when it is called for. Many people think that Shiekh Muqbil bin Hadee was hard or harsh, however this is not the case. He was easy with the people and only harsh after years of ease in issue that dealt with issues of the religion that required a harsh response. This was Shiekh Muqbil, so let’s go back to the Prophet and all we find in his life was ease and harshness when required.
I like your zeal, however misplaced zeal becomes one of two things, extreme or burnt out! May Allah you and me from both. Ameen
If what I said is not clear, ask me to clarify.
Mohamed Witten
There should be no need for a Black History month in the year 2009…every month should be a celebration of every skin color and not one specifically….because when we hold out a special month for blacks.(or any other color besides white)..what we mean is that 11 other months are a celebration of white skin…which of course it is for most of the world…America included.
Duad…dont know you dude…but you sound rather tightly wound. I might offer the opinion that there are plenty of black Muslims in the world…are you saying their history doesnt matter and shouldnt be recognized merely because it has nothing to do with Islam…if they are Muslims then it has everything to do with Islam…they are blacks that happen to be Muslims…not Muslims that happen to be black.
I think Morgan Freeman said it best and he said it before Obama was running, mind you.
“You’re going to relegate my history to a month? I don’t want a black history month. Black history is American history.”
Daud is exactly right……and mohamed witten slightly but the issue is that “black history month”isnt something islamically legislated for a muslim…….we as MUSLIMS have no care for a person’s skin color ….Shaykh muqbeel was harsh when needed to be….as islam requires and gentle when needed to be…..a lot of muslims are ignorant on basic principles in islam no need to waste time on self praise and self arrogance (i.e black history) name a companion of the prophet muhammad which pondered or studied race or linage?????? let’s observe “Bilal Ibn Rabah” who’s lineage was ARAB and ABYSSINIAN…..salman the PERSIAN.. ..and Abdulalah salam who was JEWISH……..unlike the MANA org and countless callers to the hellfire … whom they enlist to call people to nationalism and segregation …unlissted2009 we are muslims……NOT BLACK MUSLIMS!!!!!!!!!
One thing from black history month that will get us into paradise?
Malcolm X brought mad Muslims into the deen, including myself. I surely hope that gets me over the sirat. People still read his autobiography and accept Islam. Al hamdulillah.
Why is Black History month on the shortest month of the year? Anyways, I agree relegating our rich history to one month is demeaning and it allows for students to check out. I have a whole bunch of anecdotal stories to support how ridiculous the concept is. I agree that more should be done to make sure that Black history is seen as an integral part of American history, for there would be no American history without the trans-Atlantic slave trade and critical role that peoples of the African Diaspora played in the development of America.
- Do we need Black History Month? -It’s debatable.
- Do the descendants of slaves and recent Africans immigrants need to know about ‘Black’ History? - Hell Yeah.
- Is Black History Month an appropriate vehicle to act as an educating platform and tool for Blacks and Non Blacks? - On balance, I think so.
Over here in the UK black history month is in October. Myself and a few brothers have found that Black history month is an excellent way of guiding non-muslims and muslims to know about how Muslims have been a major contributor to African civilisation. Black history month is also something I’ve found that all Blacks whether African Caribbean, West African or East African can relate to and draw from. History is an excellent tool for teaching our people about the past with a view to understanding the present and thus making a brghter future. I expected that even the most ‘hardcore’ brothers would appreciate the need for a historical perspective. History encompasses numerous disciplines such as Sociology, Psychology, geography, strategy, management, economics etc. Lack of basic historical knowledge is one of the major reasons why Black people make the same mistakes generation after generation and collectively (don’t bother giving me Obama, Oprah etc as an exception to the rule in response) we don’t seem to be progressing but regressing in global terms. Lack of historical knowledge and understanding of oneself and one’s people is also one of the reasons that the descendants of slaves are having problems making a balanced, steady and SUSTAINABLE transition into Islam.
Shaykhul Islaam Muhammad ibn Abdul Wahhab, while battling the deviate sufis made a simplistically beautiful and powerful statement: “Islaam is a Deen of proofs, not opinions”.
All of you Black loving, African Diaspora claiming Muslims bring me a proof that is in line with the Book of Allaah and the Sunnah; that any part of black history that will get us into Paradise, or save us from the Hell-Fire. So far all anyone has stated has been their own philosophical ying yang. Bring a text!
February/black history can be used as a tool for da`wah. The problem is that many African-Americans who call themselves Muslim are not clear about elementary matters pertaining to the condition of the kuffaar (of any complexion). Martin Luther King, Marcus Garvey, Eli Poole, Adam Clayton Powell, Huey Newton, ad nauseum are fuel for the Naar. That’s that. Whoever doesn’t believe that the (accountable) kaafir goes to Hell forever isn’t a Muslim in the first place and would need to say the Shahadah understanding what it means and its basic implication in order to enter the fold of Islam. So first one needs to have a basic understanding of the Religion and various Religious judgments that arise before discussing history.
Sadly, too many African-Americans (who call themselves Muslim) are stuck on this negro tribalism, and that is one of the main reasons for the stagnation and in the BAM community (it has yet to jettison the baggage of the black kaafir culture–and hate that which deserves to be hated). Once it is straight about the black kaafirs who preceded us, THEN we can look at what (relative) good they did and adopt some of the techniques they implemented.
No one had as comprehensive a program for dealing with the social and psychological maladies/pathologies of the negro and the n!gga as the despicable heathen imp, Elijah Poole (known in these har parts as “Lil Peanut”). He was a minor dajjal–no doubt. We shouldn’t, however, throw out the baby with the bath water… but every Muslim needs to be PERFECTLY CLEAR that Eli Poole was a kaafir for his tashbih (resembling Allah to the created) and his belying what Allah revealed. Lil Eli had it going on in many ways, and there is A LOT that can be learned from the old Nation program… but without feeling any emotional attachment to those people.
There is a lot in “traditional black culture” (not talking so much about the contemporary immoral nihilistic ghetto culture) that could be useful–in terms of how to build relatively autonomous communities in America (for example what is in the movie, “The Great Debaters”). But, again… we need to be PERFECTLY CLEAR that those people were chitlin eatin’ pagans condemned to Hell.
We can also learn from the black kaafir HOW NOT TO BEHAVE. We can see the utter blight caused by fornication and feral bastard spawn terrorizing the streets and communities of the inner city. Seeing them (the black kaafir) should make us all the more firm about the enormous evil of sexual promiscuity and the disruption blood lines and the destruction of families caused therefrom. (You can add to that the blight of booze, swine, drugs, music, gambling, and other vices/sins.)
Also, talking about black history can be a means to grab the attention of the black kaafirs. I teach, and i see to it that the Arab and African kids i teach learn black American history… to use it as a means for da`wah. They learn black history not as a lesson in victimology (afterall, they also know that slavery is not forbidden), but as a means to know the history and culture of black Americans better than the average black American know his own history. For sure, this can leave a positive impression in the mind of the black kaafir (as opposed to assuming that the only thing an Arab knows how to do is sling 40 oz at the corner store).
In summary, we have to be honest–and UNAPOLOGETIC–about the condition of the black kaafir. When we can do that, THEN perhaps African-American Muslims can gain lessons from black history.
With Allah is the success.
swarthmoor.wordpress.com
Azizah,
I assume you know this: black history “month” started out as a week in February and was done in February because of “Presidents’ Day” (Washington/Lincoln). In the 60’s they extended it to a month.
@ Ali
Beautiful!
The worst part about ignorance is the one who is ignorant is totally blind to the fact causing his ignorance to perpetuate. The Prophet dealt in a very patronizing yet graceful way with the Badaw because they behaved like children. Children act out because they want attention, so the best way modify their behavior is to ignore it. When people ignore you it causes you to reflect which is the exact remedy to ignorance.
May Allah Elevate Us All
Ameen
@ Rasheed
What you posted has nothing to do with the price of tea in china! It’s as if you’re trying to retreat to some “moral ground” concerning this debate. In reality you don’t have it, because only that which is in accordance with the Book of Allaah and the Sunnah is the “moral ground” for the Muslim. Who can relate black history back to the Book of Allaah and the Sunnah!?! You and I both know that this blog can be bombarded with proofs from the Book and Sunnah that condemns the celebration of anything similar to black, white, arab, chinease etc history. O Muslims. The reminder benefits the believer. The Messenger of Allaah said many statements condemning the celebration of your lineage, tribe, ancestry etc. What did the icons of black history do for the call to Tawhid? They did nothing; in fact they opposed it because they weren’t Muslims!! Where’s the benefit for BAM’s in studying their history? I issued my challenge hoping that some BAM’s can see the futility in celebrating their racial history. The issues surrounding race, and many people discuss these issues in this forum, is like poison to your Deen because when someone gets grounded in it; it’s so hard to get away!!!!!!!!!!!
On the other hand, learning Islaamic history can be HIGHLY beneficial because it can be linked directly back to the Book of Allaah and the Sunnah, and then acted upon!!! Studying an Islaamic historical event like the Treaty of Hudhaybiyyah can bring immense benefit to the BAM’s. We can get volumes of beneficial knowledge that will help us get to Jennah and save us from the Hell-Fire, if we studied it at the feet of scholars. Where’s the call to that!?!
if only the rest of us were as righteous and perfect as YOU right Daud??
If you don’t like what I post, then why do you continue to visit? Some of us are just done with the psychopathic hatred and self righteous narcissism of people like you.
@Rasheed
Under normal circumstances I would agree with you, however these guys are not just merely “tolls” they are trained pawns not unlike attack dogs, they are trained to attack any attempt at social cohesion amongst indigeneous Blackamerican Muslims, so they have to be refuted. Their sole objective is to use tawheed as a ruse to vent and misdirect, divert or otherwise derail any movement. They openly flaunt the command of Allah, the sunnah akhlaq and adab of our Prophet (saws) and the salaf with glee and zeal this alone is reason to refute them but they must be refuted with action.
Most Blackamerican Muslims already have tawheed now we must go about the business of creating “social cohesion” , “group feeling” , “tribal solidarity” or whatever you want to call it. We need institutions which serve as the center for stable Blackamerican Muslim communities and uniting the ties of the womb as this is the only way to achieve it.
We must start pushing the next generation to be university educated to tamp down poverty.
Ibn Khaldun spelled out the blueprint in the muqaddimah. It is a must that the next generation of BAM leaders learn the lessons of the muqaddimah.
Abu Usamah,
I seriously doubt that the average African-American who calls himself a Muslim is rooted with even elementary understanding of traditional Islam and its related sciences. It is said the largest AA “Muslim” group is that of the Wally-World (W.D. Mohammed’s followers). We saw on this very board how people fell over themselves defending the man who said NUMEROUS statements of kufr. And the people defended Wally D. simply out of tribal/racial partisanship. If people were rooted in Tawheed and traditional `Aqidah, they would have had no problem recognizing the level of the man’s deviance and kufr.
African-American Muslims will not prosper until they :
1. LEARN the Deen. There can be no sound sense of cohesion and unity for sincere people with those who are ignorant of the Religion (and are too lazy or negligent to want to learn). It just can’t happen.
2. HATE BLACK KAAFIR CULTURE. Because of the love and attachment to that culture, you have AA Muslims still listening to their music (which is an OBVIOUS instrument that the folks with real power use to keep the black kaafir savages in their despicable state), dress like the black kaafir, imitate the black kaafir in his values and notions of “success” (whether it be the Jack and Jill house negroes or the street corner predators). BAM should be FLEEING from that culture and planting in the hearts of their children a HATRED (for the sake of Allah) of the vile pathological behavior the black kaafir culture promotes. To the contrary, we have second generation African-American Muslim youth who are almost devoid of Deen but in love knuckle draggin’ simian rap savages. And that is largely because the parents did not instil in their children a revulsion for those kaafirs–instead, they were taught that “those are our ‘people.’”
BAM need to learn their Religion, for the basis of unity is the KNOWLEDGE OF THE DEEN. With the knowledge of the Deen, nobody’s going to be confused about the status of the kaafir (of any stripe). Out of our concern (i said “concern”–not “love”) for the black kaafir (or kaafir of any other color), we can call them to the Oneness and Perfection of the Creator and to reform their behavior by following what the Prophet taught.
Lastly, your “blackamerican” author argues that the matters of `aqidah are not particulary important–and too complex for the average darkie to understand. (He actually dares to devote a couple of paragraphs to this issue.) So his call isn’t really to Tawheed but some sort of modified negro nationalism dressed up in the garb of Islam. Oh, and let me add, do you think the average stuck-on-black AA Muslim is going to be able to get over what Ibn Khaldun said about the “blacks” to grasp his larger message?
With Allah is the success.
swarthmoor.wordpress.com
I am glad to see some admit that in Islam you must hate black people and flee from them even when you are black yourself.
BTW, swathmoor, I think that Daud would take issue with your concept of Tawheed seeing as how I assume you do not believe that Allah has a form, hands, feet, and a face
@Kareem
I hope your post was sarcastic, yet in any event BAMs do not have run from being BLACK the Prophet (saws) already told the Arabs that they should be kind to the Blacks because they have ancestor and marriage ties and this was before the balad al-sudan had been reverted to Islam.
I will say is that the beast is cleaver. By sending his pawns to create disunity he thinks that will detur people but the call to Islam is too strong, yet the BAMs have to learn from our mistakes that’s why knowing the full history of BLACKS is so important. The Prophet (saws) said learn as much of your lineage as is necessary to establish your ties of kindred.
Believe me there is a reason why EVERY TIME unity is spoken the al-jolson (lol) Muslims come screaming hate this and hate that.
This is there only trump card they have left. They undermine community building and keep feeding the disunity and false flag sufi/salafi debate going.
Allowing the RAND corp and Nixon Center papers to “leak” on the internet LOL if they are so careless in allowing their plans to get out why haven’t we seen the documentation of their plans to dismantle the Dar ul-Islam Movement, or the 40 yr conspiracy against Imam Jamil or the continued going attempts to entrap Imam Siraj?
We must learn the FULL Black history perhaps then we will understand why jamaat and the selection of ameers were commanded and that there is no way around either and if we do not teach are children to build communities then Allah will bring in another wave of Muslims that will. As ibn Khaldun pointed out “leadership over people who share in a given group feeling cannot be vested in those not of the same descent” self hate will not get you to the group feeling required to sustain communities
@ Abu Usamah
When the attack dog has nothing left to chase it will bite it’s own tail. Now enough about the children back grown man business. This social cohesion or Asabiya that was referred to by Ibn Khaldun doesn’t necessarily have to be created along the lines of race. A lot of American Muslims Black or otherwise don’t fit so neatly into our pre-defined social constructs. (Ehm… yours truly). We are constantly being redefined into smaller and smaller groups. In fact many of us belong to many tribes but probably don’t even realize it. There is a book on the shelves called “Tribes” by a guy named Seth Goodin. In it he analyzes how social constructs are changing in the 21st century.
One of the good things about this blog is that it provides a microsm of the debates and differences that exist within the Muslim Black community. As is obvious from the range of comments above-we can’t even agree on basic notions such as the need for having historical appreciation in our understanding of our affairs. This is really pitiful. I think that until we have resolve these basic issues we’ll end up imitating the worst of why most Muslim societies are in decline instead of learning from the best of why and how they rose. It’s particularly serious in light of the fact that the descendants of slaves (African Americans / African Caribbeans etc) are a nation who were born out of very unique circumstances and currently have quite specific characteristics/qualities (which are unique to them and aren’t held by virtually any other tribes around the world) that need to be identified and equationed into any analysis of how to become stable and steadfast in this deen. It makes me sad that such common sense concerns and issues are rubbished simply as ‘Dunyah’ and ‘psycho babble’. The fact that Black Muslims are in this elementary stage of discussion shows how extreme and damaging the effects of slavery and post slavery were.
Kareem,
Here is one for you–and this is the PROPER application of the Hadith:
“If one accuses his brother of kufr then it falls back on you–or it is as he said.”
NEVER have i said–and i don’t believe–that Allah has a hand, foot, form, tibia, face, etc. So, for your own safety, don’t accuse people of being something that they are not.
Look at what I said again. I know YOU did not believe that. But I am sure that your friend Daud would disagree as salafis DO believe that Allah has a form, two hands, two feet, a face, two eyes, a shin, smiles and so forth.
@Rasheed
I haven’t read that book, but the question I would ask is who is defining the change in social construct? I will cede that the notion of race is an articificial construct, yet to deny that there is a social group of “Blackamericans” would be absurd. What I am saying is that Black American Muslims have a right due to historical circumstances to be recognized as a national minority (as defined by the UN) and is entitled to some form of self-determination. And that Islam is the vehicle for the expression of that self-determination for the formerly enslaved peoples. Now if Black American Muslims are not entitled to form “group feeling” along these lines then which “lines” do you suggest?
Before this self-determination can be actualized “group feeling” must be restored to the formerly enslaved peoples. Jamaat (community) and leadership from amongst ourselves must be selected. I am not saying that this precludes non-Blacks from being part of the community. Yet the reality is that there has never been a society where the core group were not kindred people who formed the prevailing attitudes. This is true of all societies including Islaimc societies.
The core group of the first Muslims were for the most part kindred and related via marriage.
Take Abu Jahl whose early support was critical to the Muslims and yet he is probably headed for the fire (Allahu Alim) do you think he supported the Prophet (saws) because he believed in tawheed and what the Prophet brought or did he support the Prophet (saws) because he was his nephew who was known to be honest, charitable and just?
A reformer can not bring about change to a people if he does not have the support of his kindred both those that follow him as well as those who do not follow him yet support him.
Do you think Abu Jahl would have still extended his support if all heard of the message was that the Arabs were the worst of mankind and they all are to be hated until they believe? Do you think Abu Jahl would have still extended his support to a Prophet from Ruum sent to the Arabs?
Another example of the benefit of engendering “group feeling” could be seen after my comrades in Pittsburg were attacked by the FBI using the ruse that they were looking for a felon (the same tactic they used in their first assault on the DAR ), the govn’t then attempted to demonize them in the media in preparation for the next open attack, but it was the people in the surrounding neighborhood who came to their defense in the media thwarting their plans.
This was because although the brothers are firm, the non-Muslim people had “group feeling” for them because of the good they brought to the people, rather than calling them “black kaafir” and having hatred for them.
Blacks already got hatred, go to any inner-city “hood” in America and you can find someone who will say “aint no love for the other side” that’s easy. Our task is to build (and the pawns job is to prevent it) and we can do so with in the confines of the sharia.
And lets keep it real what other grouping of people have collectively shown more openess to Islam in the West than Blacks both in europe and america? Are we to reward this openess with open hostility and hatred?
I am not saying you advocate these things I’m just speaking in general.
@Uk Brother,
with all due respect there is agreement with having historical appreciation in our understanding of our affairs, discussion is what is the best way to achieve it.
The pawns are of no consequence how is someone who has bayah to a king whose ruling circle has named an entire nation after their tribe and religion controled by another family, presumes to give lessons on nationalism. LOL
As one of my elders always reminds me, shaytan is always doing his job, so the Muslims have to keep doing ours.
@ Kareem,
First, i would like to apologize. Reading is fundamental, as some say. I misread the post. Nonetheless, what Daud has said is in essence correct: learning “black” history without understanding Deen leads to fitnah. And afterall, most of the strife here on this board comes from people’s ignorance of the Religion.
Secondly, i did not say one has to hate black people. There have been MANY pious black Muslims. I said that one has to hate BLACK KAAFIR CULTURE. Given that the two “pillars” of contemporary black culture are built upon the sins music and fornication (and, of course, the sin of music feeds into the sin of fornication), such a culture has to be hated. One can add a third pillar, although it is losing its centrality to black kaafir culture, and that would be the Negro Church. Kufr is the greatest sin (and fornication is the third greatest sin), and certainly can’t be loved by a Muslim.
I’m curious, can you name any significant aspect of black culture that is not related to sin? And i am talking about what is esteemed in the general popular culture. We can’t in all honesty say, for instance, “integrity” or “family values.”
@ Abu Usamah
You are calling for unity and cohesion–but upon what is it based? The basis of unity is KNOWLEDGE OF THE RELIGION. First and foremost, it is knowledge of the CREED. If people calling themselves Muslims do not have the same belief in Allah, then THEY CAN’T POSSIBLY BE UNITED. The first and foremost issue is to give people CLARITY as to what is the CORRECT CREED and who is wrong and who is right. And that is not a particularly difficult thing to do for the SINCERE.
As for the intellectually lazy, they don’t want to go into the matters of the Creed. Probably sort of for the reasons that your man Jackson says. Nonetheless, if we don’t have a working definition of who is a Muslim and what constitutes Islam and who is on the CORRECT path (and it ain’t a person who merely says the Shahadah, for Farrakhan says the Shahadah)–and if people don’t care to know, well these people aren’t going to excel in the Deen.
Also, it needs to be clear in every Muslim’s mind that ordering the good and forbidding the evil is not a bad thing. You may have a problem in HOW it is being done, but the principle is sound. What Daud, for example, has said on this thread has not been countered by kind of Religious proofs. Instead he’s mocked. This all the more indicates that the methodology of the quasi-traditionalist-negro nationalists has little weight.
Lastly, all Muslim need to be clear about the matters of apostasy. This is not a secondary or tertiary aspect of the Religion. There are MANY people calling themselves Muslim today who are not because they commited apostasy unknowingly. Many Muslims are not even aware that the Baab-ur-Riddah (Chapter of Apostasy) exists in the books of traditional knowledge. If they did, then they would be certain that Abu Jahl is going to Hell… forever. And the same can be said of any mukallaf kaafir–because this is what the Qur’an says EXPLICITLY. Again, it is confusion, ambiguity, ignorance, and lack of clarity on these very fundamental matters of `Aqidah (such as being confused about accountable disbelievers being condemned to Hell) that forces people to speak out and warn against these prevalent misconceptions. If people were clear on these issues, then other matters, such as Muslim unity could be discussed. Again, until the matters of the Creed are clarified, there will not be any sincere Islamic solidarity.
The Messenger of Allaah said
“the Ummah can NOT unite upon falsehood.”
Umar ibn Khattab (radiyyallaahu anhu) related that the Messenger of Allaah (salallaahu alayhi wa salam) said,
“Our honor is in the Deen of Islaam. Anyone who seeks honor by any other means will be humiliated”.
@Swarthmoor & Daud
Since you both are so fond providing answers to questions which you were never asked can either of you or your teachers what was the basis of the Prophet (saws) keeping ties and accepting support from Abu Jahl
@ abu Usama
I know where you’re trying to go, but you’re trying to use a true statement to establish a false principle. Black history is a celebration of the achievements etc of the Black folks in America’s tribe, and their achievements. This is not permissible in Islaam. If you read any related links on Tariq’s blog you will see the proofs from the Book and the Sunnah. After that, what else could there be for you to say?
The asl of this debate is, should Muslims participate in the celebration of black history; based on the Book of Allaah and the Sunnah; the answer is no!
Abu Usamah,
First of all, i know you have a penchant for ad hominem attacks. Secondly, whom i learned from does not undermine the VALIDITY of what i have said. I haven’t said anything that was RELIGIOUSLY INCORRECT. If i did, let me know, for i am very willing to correct myself, as i did with Kareem earlier in this thread. Thirdly, i already provided you with a list of books i have taken by talaqi (oral transmission), including, At-Tahawi and Al-Ibana and a good part of An-Nasafi’s Creed and Abu Shuja`ah’s book in Shafi`i Fiqh, as well as, books in Fiqh and `Aqidah from my shaykh (via his top level students). I am not self-taught, and there is nothing in my posts that indicates such.
Fourthly, i said i wouldn’t provide my teachers UNTIL basic principles get ironed out, such as, you agreeing with me that the one who says: “We are the children of Allah,” has made an explict statement of kufr. Let’s go thru the steps, then we will be (more or less) on the same page–besides your correcting yourself for the statement you made previously about “thanking someone for slandering the Deen.”
The problem here Abu Usamah is that people are choosing bits and pieces of history to justify a twisted apologist agenda IN THE GUISE OF TRADITIONAL ISLAMIC SCHOLARSHIP. That’s what’s going on–and THAT is what the Rand Report is all about. You want to point to some sort of “interfaith solidarity” between the African-American Muslims and the black kaafirs, when you know–and i know–that probably half the African-Americans calling themselves Muslims do not know, do not believe, or are confused about whether or not these black kaafirs (if they die on kufr) are going to Hell… FOREVER.
IF African-American Muslims WERE CRYTSAL CLEAR on the issue of the kaafirs being condemned to Hell, and could deal with the black kaafirs FROM A POSITION OF DOMINANCE, then there could be the potential of working with them FOR THE BENEFIT OF THE MUSLIMS. But that means that sinning–and enabling others to sin–would not be involved. Given the average AA Muslim (and often even their leaders) hasn’t ever studied even a primer in Fard-ul-`Ayn, that just ain’t likely to happen.
Many African-Americans who call themselves Muslim are confused about the most elementary matters of the Religion, such as, not being able to acknowledge that the one who belies the Religion has commited kufr (as was the case with W.D. Mohammed when he claimed the kaafir could marry the Muslimah–in spite of what the Qur’an says). Given this to be the case, HOW IN THE WORLD are AA Muslims going to “unify” with black kaafirs without sinning?
Just so you know, Abu Usamah, the Prophet was perfectly clear that Abu Jahl (The Father of Ignorance–which is an INSULT in itself (so much for what YOU would call “good manners”)) was a kaafir and would be condemned to Hell if he died as such. That’s not that case with many African-Americans who call themselves Muslims–for many do not know or acknowledge that their dead (mukallaf) kaafir relatives are fuel for the Naar. Furthermore, you only told, as is often the case of those on the apologist agenda, HALF THE STORY of Abu Jahl. The other half of the story is that the Prophet had Abu Jahl SLAUGHTERED on the battlefield.
Lastly, Abu Usamah, unity is based on knowledge–on knowledge of the TRUTH. It should be evident that all these groups calling themselves “Muslim” with all kinds of methodologies and even different beliefs can’t possibly be right–some can’t even be Muslim. So the only question that should concern the SINCERE is who is right and how would i know that? When African-American Muslims make that their NUMBER ONE PRIORITY–and not “unity”–then perhaps, in-sha’ Allah, African-American Muslims will become united and become successful.
With the Help of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful
I too once objected to “Black History Month”. Not because of any proof, evidence, or Divine Guidance that to celebrate such a month was haraam. I did so because it happened to be the shortest month of the year. Then later I learned that it was actually started by Carter G. Woodson, as someone has written, as Black history week in conjunction with Presidents Day. So I came to understand that Black History Month grew out of that and was not necessarily some “White Conspiracy” to observe Black History in the shortest of all Months.
For those taking exception to Black History Month arguing like Morgan Freeman, that a history of a people cannot be confined to one month regardless if it is a month of 28, 29, 30, or 31 days, your point is well taken.
However, I do disagree with those who argue that Black History Month is “Un-Islaamic”. I have seen Brother Daud ask for evidence, yet I have not seen his or Swarthmoor’s, (who ironically has a Moniker that suggests “Knowledge” of Black History), evidence upon which they understand that Black History Month is Un-Islaamic.
I am a bit disappointed that no one has attempted to address this question from any Proof or Sign from the Qur’aan. I will attempt to do so Insha Allah.
0A
Allah has revealed:
“Oh man! surely We have created you of a male and a female, and made you tribes and families that you may know each other; surely the most honorable of you with Allah is the one among you most in Taqwa; surely Allah is Knowing, Aware.” [QK 49:13]
Here is poof first that Allah has created us different, as part of nations and tribes or as a part of different cultural groups. This is done so that we may KNOW EACH OTHER! So I ask the question, if a person has no knowledge of his nation, tribe, or cultural group under which he or she has been brought forth into the world by Allah, then how can anyone KNOW this person as Allah intended? If a person or people only20know of the “Dominant Culture”, then they can only mimic that culture in all respects and they themselves become UNKOWN! Or, if all they know of their nation and tribe is how it was impacted upon by the “Dominant Cultural Group” and of what changes took place as a result of this DOMINATION, then such a person most likely will mimic only the worse of what his or her nation, tribe, or cultural group has come to be. When you only know of the Dominant Culture, or only know the worse of your culture, then you will most likely mimic either and never truly reflect what Allah intended for others to know through you by creating us as different cultural groups in the first place!
I think the term “Celebration” is rather misplaced or rather is being misused here. Observation and Understanding of different nations, tribes, and cultural groups should simply be for the purpose of “KNOWING THEM”. This Allah intends!! It should not be seen as a “Celebration” or a “Bragging” or “Boasti ng” of Superiority!! This Allah does not intend and clearly informs us that it is Taqwa which is the most Honorable Distinction.
I think we as Muslims, particularly those who are descendents from the “Maghrib” (West-Africa) actually have self hatred. A lot of this is because we only relate to the “worse” of our experiences. In reading the writings of Swarthmoor, it is as if all he sees in “Black History” is fornication, music, and acts of kufar. So I think at times, we turn to Islaam as an escape, and at times, what we really are doing is not turning to Islaam, but we are turning to another culture of 1,400 years ago, an Arab/Turko/Persian culture. The sira, ahadith, an other literature further us along in this escape as they provide for us a mode of acting, down to personal habits, that are different from “American Negro” habits. We understand this makes us “closer to Allah”. But without serious study and reflection upon Qur’aan, the revelation of Allah and the best Hadith so says Allah, then other sources taken out of context of the Qur’aan can actually lead us “further from Allah”.
As “Black” people, lacking knowledge of our history, we are more susceptible to understanding Islaam as a religion that does not have any place for “love of relatives” or Asabiyah. Abu Usamah making reference to Ibn Khaldun and the Muqqadimah wrote with wisdom!! If you truly understood “Islaamic History” you would truly come to know that the Arabs, neither the Persians, think that the Qur’aan imposed upon them to abandon their cultural ties. The words of Allah provides evidence for them and against us who argue “Black History Month” as an exercise in observation, that is not celebration or boasting, is haraam.
Allah has revealed:
The Prophet has a greater claim on the faithful than they have on themselves, and his wives are (as) their mothers; and the possessors of relationship have first priority between each other in the decree of Allah, than with the Mu’minin, and the Muhaajirin, except that you do some good to your friends; this is written in the Book. [QK 33:6]
Allah has revealed:
And one of His signs is the creation of the heavens and the earth and the diversity of your tongues and colors; most surely there are signs in this for the learned. [QK 30:22]
Allah has revealed:
And We did not send any apostle but with the langua ge of his people, so that he might explain to them clearly; then Allah makes whom He pleases err and He guides whom He pleases and He is the Mighty, the Wise. [QK 14:4]
Allah has revealed:
They ask you as to what they should spend. Say: Whatever wealth you spend, it is for the parents and the near of kin and the orphans and the needy and the wayfarer, and whatever good you do, Allah surely knows it. [QK 2:215]
Allah has revealed:
Surely Allah enjoins the doing of justice and the doing of good (to others) and the giving to the kindred, and He forbids indecency and evil and rebellion; He admonishes you that you may be mindful. [QK 16:90]
Allah has revealed:
And certainly We know that they say: Only a mortal teaches him. The tongue of him whom they reproach is barbarous, and this is clear Arabic tongue. [QK 16:103]
Allah has revealed:
For the protection of the Quryaish–Their protection during their trading caravans in the winter and the summer–So let them serve the Lord of this House Who feeds them against hunger and gives them security against fear. [QK 16:103]
Allah has revealed:
That is of which All ah gives the good news to His servants, (to) those who believe and do good deeds. Say: I do not ask of you any reward for it but love for my near relatives; and whoever earns good, We give him more of good therein; surely Allah is Forgiving, Grateful. [QK 42.23]
When Allah reveals that those with relationships have rights with regard to one another, that cannot be given over to others who are Mu-minin and Muhaajirin, what would you accuse Allah of being guilty of? When Allah reveals that it is an Arabic Qur’aan, and not of a “foreign” tongue, what would you accuse Allah of being guilty of? Would Allah be guilty of “Boasting” of Arabic over other languages? I bet some of us are forming our responses to this right now because as Muslims we make this boast don’t we, although we read that there were previous revelations in other languages and that our various languages are all “signs” from Allah. So we can find justification for making “Arab” superior and “Black” or “ non-Arab” inferior. Is that the true crime of “Black History Month”, that it does not boast “Arabism”?
When Allah reveals to humanity concerning the protection for the tribe of Quryaish, what would you accuse Allah of being guilty of? When Allah reveals that we should give to kindred, what would you accuse Allah of being guilty of? When Allah has the Prophet (SAW) to say ask nothing for the promises of the Divine Guidance except LOVE FOR MY NEAR RELATIVES,….WHAT DO YOU ACCUSE ALLAH OF BEING GUILTY OF??
So, I hope I have offered at least something to be considered as some “proof” or “evidence” regarding Black History Month as something not haraam. As I understand it, Black History Month is an observation and understanding of something that we have been made not to understand and historically, a deliberate effort has been made not to observe it rather to dist ort it. But I don’t understand how any Muslim of “maghribi descent” could fail to see that “Black History Month” offers an opportunity for observation and reflection upon the “African” empires of Ghana, Mali, and Songhay, all Islaamic nations before the “Transatlantic Slave Trade” proof to our people of our Islaam, BEFORE Mr. Elijah Muhammad and BEFORE us being subjected to the roman religion of christianity!
@ Swarthmoor, Black History Month or rather knowledge of Black History, assuming you are Black, is a must for a Muslim who descends from the “Maghrib” because as a Muslim you have a responsibility to Allah regarding your people.
Allah has revealed:
“And warn your nearest relations,” [QK 26:214]
How can you be successful in warning your nearest relations if you do not understand their history? Even the prophets, Allah has revealed, are sent in the language of their people. To understand the language, you must understand the history. This will make you better able to “warn your nearest relations” as Allah has commanded. Maybe your family and Daud and others have a family where all are Muslim, al-Hamdilallah. But if not, have you ever considered that all of the “kufr” you so detest in “Black” American culture may be of our failure as Muslims of “maghribi descent” to effectively warn our nearest relations? Not only are we to warn them, but Muslims are to warn and argue with non-Muslims by means and manners which are best. Allah knows best, but I would not think your arguments are the best.
Case in point, your constant and rather flippant use of the word Kafir. Do you know the Arabic meaning of Kafir? Kafir comes from the root K-F-R. It means “to cover”. It refers to those who know the truth of Allah as being the Supreme Intelligence, the One Creator, but they “cover over” this truth as if they don’t know it. The common English “Disbeliever” does not do the word Kafir justice in terms of rendering a more exact meaning. If Black history was given proper observation, you might come to realize that “Black” people have been “Made” not to know the truth of Allah’s Oneness. When one does not know the truth, they cannot be guilty of “covering the truth”. In Arabic, ignorance of “truth” is expressed by the word “Jaahil”. If you and all of us as Muslim first understanding this, then again Allah gives us guidance as Muslims for addressing the “Jaahil”.
Allah has revealed:
And the servants of Ar-RaHmaan are they who walk on the earth in humbleness, and when the “JaaHilun” address them, they say: Salaam. [QK 25:63]
It is true what you say of Black peoples shortcomings, may Allah have mercy upon us all. But in terms of our duty to warn our nearest relatives, we may be best able to fulfill our obligation to Allah to warn in the best manner by addressing the ignorant in the attitude of Salaam, Peace, rather than with the attitude of “you Kafir worthy of “Hellfire”. Would it not be ironic, if these “Jaaahil” find Mercy from Allah because of their ignorance, but we find the Hellfire as an abode? This would be fitting because despite or “knowledge” our harsh and hard attitude towards our Jaahil relatives caused them to further go astray meaning we failed our obligation to Allah in warning our nearest relatives all because we did not address them with Salaam as Allah guided us nor did we warn in manners that were best as Allah commanded us. (QK 16:125)
Wa Allahu-A’lim
B Musa,
Firstly, not to nitpick, but this is an important matter in `Aqidah: i would advise you not to say what gives the meaning that something occured “contrary to the way Allah intended.” It gives the impression that Allah has willed one matter, and the creations have willed something contrary to what Allah has willed. Perhaps this is not what you meant, but such language is like that of the Mu`tazilah and feeds into people’s prevalent confusion about Allah’s Destining and human will.
I don’t think i said ANYWHERE that it is not good for African-American Muslims to learn black history. As a matter of fact, i went thru the black-thing back in college, and by the mercy of Allah, i later became a Muslim largely b/c of my readings in black nationalism/Afrocentricity. Furthermore, i lecture on the subject. The problem is when people WHO ARE NOT ROOTED IN THE ELEMENTARY MATTERS OF THE DEEN attempt to study black history… as written by the kuffaar. It feeds into a racist-tribalistic mind set and a twisted emotional attachment to the black kaafir culture, which has no basis in the Deen.
It does seem you are mixing issues here, B Musa. Knowing the status of kaafir kin does not mean necessarily severing the ties of kinship. Nonetheless, in one’s dealings with kaafir kin, one must be careful not to help them in sinning or entertain them in their haraam (such as, sitting with them while drinking alcohol, consuming the hit-in-the-head carcasses, the swine, etc.). Afterall, the Qur’an says:
“Do not assist each other in sin and transgression.”
So believing kaafir kin are condemned to Hell forever:
“Whoever does not believe in Allah AND HIS MESSENGER, then he is among the KAAFIREEN condemned to Hell.” (Al-Fath, 13)
…and being kind to kaafir kin are not mutually exclusive. To the contrary, one should treat them kindly and help them (in matters that are halaal) seeking the reward from Allah.
With that said, B Musa, the issue is who is right? One person may say some “nice” sounding-flowery things, but THEY ARE WRONG. Another may be a bit harsh, but HE IS RIGHT. Give me the people who are right any day over the deviants. Regarding the meaning of the term “kaafir,” i obviously wasn’t using it in its etymological sense–i was obviously using the term “kaafir” in its Shar` sense. It is well known that the kaafir is anyone who is ghayru-Muslim (non-Muslim)–and this is the sense that it is used most often in the books of Fiqh. This meaning of “kaafir” in this sense has nothing to do with whether or not the person “hides or rejects” the Truth. Furthermore, i qualified my statement by mentioning the ACCOUNTABLE kaafir is condemned to Hell–and not the kaafir baby, or the one who never heard the Shahadah in a language he understands. Consequently, there is a distinction between being an unaccountable kaafir (such as the ignorant one who never heard the Call to Islam) and the one who did (which would include the VAST MAJORITY of black kaafirs in America). Both the accountable and non-accountable non-Muslims, nonetheless, are called “kaafir.”
Now i do agree that because so maaaaaaany AA Muslims are ignorant (and many suffer from other black ghetto pathologies) that AA Muslims have been largely inept in giving da`wah to the kuffaar. The problem is further compounded by the fact that you have quasi-Muslims, like W.D. Mohammed, claiming that there is no compelling reason for the kaafir to embrace Islam, since, Christians, too, (according to him) are from the Mu’mineen (”Believers”) and will be saved in the Hereafter. This is a lie–and it is a lie that renders one a kaafir.
Also, i have NO PROBLEM, in general, being nice and polite with the kuffaar. It is an important aspect of da`wah–however, i am keenly aware of their status. My first concern is the Muslims and dispelling the grievous and poisonous misconception in the AA Muslim communities (and other Muslim communities) that somehow these kaafirs will be saved in the Hereafter. If Muslims are silent about this matter–especially, when the enemies of Islam are openly advocating that Muslims renounce their conviction that salvation is exclusive to Islam–then it leads to undermining the Religion itself. So let us be clear about fundamental matters in the Religion. There is no “polite way” of saying the kaafir is condemned to Hell–but that is the fact of the matter. Let us state these issues unambiguously and clarify the misconceptions and confusion–THEN and only then, will AA Muslims be able to effectively deliver the da`wah.
With Allah is the success.
swarthmoor.wordpress.com
I converted to Islam in mid January of this year. The city I live in has a black majority, and the mosque in the city are basically the same, though there are a few Asians and Arabs. When I was looking to learn about Islam I went to two mosque, one was more an Arab and Asian majority mosque. When I went there I felt very uncomfortable and didn’t get much help from the people there. Then I went to another mosque that was black majority, and the people there were better and I had more in common with them. So there is where I converted, because of circumstances I haven’t been able to learn much in the few weeks. The last time I was there I was shocked to see some pamphlet on the bulletin board about a celebration of black history month there. This really put me off, because as far as I’m aware being “black” has nothing to do with Islam, and I wont be going to that mosque this month, and probably never again. Being white it is very difficult to find a mosque here, because so many of them are geared towards a particular ‘ethnicity,’ I don’t know if this is true in other cities or countries. A lot of the black Muslims I’ve come across have also been black nationalist to some point, I have little contact with Muslims of other races, so I don’t know what to think at the moment.
Serge,
First and foremost place you energy in learning the Religion. The most important thing you need to learn are the matters of the Creed (`Aqidah). Know that Allah is One: Allah has no partners, Allah is not a body and has no parts. Allah is Unique and has no similars. Allah has no beginning and is not subject to time, change, or development. Allah was (existing) before the creations, and Allah is as He was (no gender intended). Allah is the One and Only Creator–whatever Allah has willed to be shall be. Whatever you imagine, Allah is different from that. This is the core of the Muslim creed. Hold on to that, and if you genuinely understand that, God-willing, you will be able to identify those beliefs which are unsound and invalid.
Regarding the social stuff, again, you are going to have to be sincere and put forth the effort to find people who are teaching genuine traditional Islamic knowledge. That means you have to ask the right questions with an earnest heart–and not be lazy and not allow yourself to sulk into depression or despair. Seek, and strive to obey your Lord–the One Who does not resemble anything in any way WHATSOEVER.
I know that i may seem like a hardline kinda guy here, but if you have any questions feel free to ask. God-willing, i can get you answers that will make sense.
With Allah is the success.
swarthmoor.wordpress.com
Swarthmoor,
My energies are geared toward learning the religion, I just think it would be better to learn things first hand at the mosque, instead of the internet. There is a lot of good info on the net, but also a lot of bad stuff.
I try to looks past the social/cultural aspects, but they do exist and play a role in how people conduct themselves. I was under the impression race and nationality has no place in Islam, which isn’t always that way in the ‘real world.’ I’m not one of these guys who decided to convert to Islam after reading Malcolm X’s autobiography, or because of kebabs, fetish for brown women, etc. I converted after reading a translation of the Quran and reading early Islamic history. When I go to the mosque this is what I want to hear and learn about, not black History month or Pakistani Independence day.
Serge,
A great contemporary scholar, Shaykh Muqbil (rahimahullaah) advised those new to Islaam in the West to learn Islaam from the books of the Scholars of Islaam; not the people because many of the people are bad.
Get books like “Aqeedatu Waasitiyyah” by Ibn Taymiyyah, especially if you can get the version that has Shaykh Uthaymeen’s notes (rahimahullaah). Uthaymeen also explained an excellent book called “The Three Fundamental Principles of Islaam”. Those are good books for english speakers.
We should disregards posts from B-musa and others who obviously arent grounded or even use usool at-tafseer(the fundamentals of quranic exegesis) you have not presented any tafseer of the ayaat you have NOT presented NOR mentioned anything but self interpretation of islamic texts….as for serge….he.is a perfect example how all that black and I’m proud crap and any other racist or nationalistic crap only alienates and runs people away… that crap . isnt deen or sunnah no matter how much taweel is made to seem it is…..februrary and every other month,year and day is…is to study deen that’s enough…..Unlizzted2009
@ unlissted
As-salaamu-a’laikum:
Would you be able to take the ayaats that I used and provide the qur-aanic exegesis to illustrate to the believers how incorrect and ungrounded my response was?
@ B-Musa,
I will paraphrase what Daud said earlier: you are quoting the truth to support a false principle. When AA Muslims learn black history, from whom are they learning it? More often than not they are learning it from kuffaar. If the writer has a Muslim name, more often than not, he is someone who himself has not learned the Religion properly (very often he is a Wally-Worlder or a Farrakhani). As for the readers, most AA Muslims have not learned even the basic matters of Fiqh (much less how that relates to various issues that come up in history), so how are they going to interpret events, if they don’t know the Religious judgments related to historical events (or even know that there are Religious judgments related to historical events). Many AA Muslims, of course, are even shaky (in the extreme) in the matters of Creed.
The problem is further compounded when many of the black writers have an explicitly anti-Islamic agenda, like Chancellor Williams and Molefi Asante. So-called “Shaykh” Anta Diop was an evolutionist. The 60’s black nationalists generally leaned towards Marxism/atheism (although some of them apparently became Muslim). George James was a Christian negro–and most of the writing about AA history has very strong Negro Church under currents. Given that the average AA Muslim is OBLIVIOUS to the chapter of apostasy, it wouldn’t be wise to suggest that they “get into” black history without learning their Religion first–and severing their attachment to black kaafir culture.
Also, what i see in the way black history is taught is that it reinforces the sense of victimization in the black kaafir (and many AA Muslims who feel attached to them). The fact is that African Muslims captured African mushriks and sold them to European mushriks There were some abuses among the Muslims, but in general, there was nothing is haraam in that. The European mushriks abused and tortured the African mushriks. (Also, African mushriks sold fellow African mushriks to their European mushrik brethren–and that probably constituted most of the trade.) Well, the European abuse of the African mushriks was an example of how cruel the kuffaar are to each other–so OF COURSE they are going to be unjust to the Muslims. Since these kuffaar abuse themselves by being disobedient to Allah, then it isn’t practical to expect them to be just to one another.
The tragedy in all of this is that Muslims themselves got wrapped up in the slave trade–as in getting kidnapped and sold to the kuffaar (a matter which is haraam). Furthermore, by selling the African mushriks, it would lead to strengthening the European mushrik economies, and later the Europeans, because of their economic wealth, were able to dominate and colonize the Muslim world.
The lesson to learn is that those African Muslims that were brought here were not able to maintain, preserve, and transmit the Deen to the subsequent generations and as a result, you have generations of Christian negroes who knew anything about the Religion of (some of) their ancestors. AA Muslims need to see to it today that the Deen is preserved and transmitted to those who follow us. And that can only be done by insuring the youth learn their Religion CORRECTLY and that we build institutions and communities that will enable Islam to flourish in this country. That, in a nutshell, is the lesson of black history. Most of the other stuff in black history is a bunch of Frankfurt School political correctness–that has an ALTOGETHER different agenda to it–and it certainly has NOTHING to do with furthering the cause of Islam.
@ B-Musa,
The responses you have received is the reason why a while ago I stoped posting ayah to blogs. For many the discussion isn’t sincere.
They have an objective and that is to disrupt unity or any posititive discussion on growing Islamic values within Black culture
One guy and his co-hort lack erudition and are simply trained pawns who are provided to same ole talking points which have been used since the 1970s to divide and distract Black Muslims in America, for them the only thing left is to wait for the “burnout” to occur and another guy his job is to chase people away from correct traditional Islam by placing an uncouth ill mannered wrapper over it, thereby blotting it’s light from reaching people that need it.
Akhlaq and adab and the uswa hassana of the Prophet (saws) are essential to the deen in fact as you may know has its own category of usul-fiqh.
And while some accepted the deen on sole basis of the truthfulness of tawheed itself, others accepted on the basis of what they knew of the Prophet’s (saws) truthfulness of character.
Alhamdulillah while I applaud your effort to explain jahalil vs kufr, he already knows this he only uses kufr for sensational effect then to proke others he attacks Black Muslims living or deceased by name (it doesn’t matter all flesh is tasty) all the while shamelessly pluging his own blog. Whether I disagree with certain leaders or not they each deserve respect.
correction
In a post above I made a huge typo blunder typing Abu Jahl instead of Abu Talib
Abu Usamah,
My objective isn’t to disrupt unity BASED UPON TRUTH. My objective is to ORDER THE GOOD AND FORBID THE EVIL. (And disrupts deviants from uniting against the Truth.) When people are calling others to kufr IN THE GUISE OF ISLAM, well someone has to say something–especially, when others are collectively silent.
Where is the sincerity, Abu Aswad–i have asked you what is wrong with the content of what i said? What is your issue with me? That i am correct–but i happen to be a little harsh? Okay, i am not going to be “polite” with those who are misguiding others. Perhaps some others will defend the Truth in a softer tone. As long as they defend the Truth, i don’t have a problem with that.
It’s obvious that your agenda is to obscure the matters of deviance and guidance and mix matters up in the minds of the people. You have no desire to lay it out on the table regarding who is right and who is wrong. You are calling deviants to put aside their differences in the name of unity–but you don’t speak about ordering the good and forbidding the evil. Where is the sincerity in that?
Not all leaders deserve respect–the so-called Haakim Bi-Amrillah and Ghulaam Ahmad don’t deserve respect. Nor does Louis Farrakhan. Likewise, a person who says that the kaafir can marry the Muslimah–in spite of knowing what the Qur’an says–does not deserve respect. And all the more such a person doesn’t deserve respect when he claims the reason that a Muslimah can marry a Christian is because Christians are actually “Believers,” and will be saved in the Hereafter. This was the position of W.D. Mohammed. Warning people–and letting them know that such a claim is kufr does not constitute “ghibah”–but it is an obligation to warn Muslims against deviant beliefs and warn others about those who cheat in the name of the Deen.
Lastly, the jahili kaafir is merely a TYPE OF KAAFIR. We don’t call the native pagan folks living in the jungles of the Amazon “Muslims”–they are kaafir–however they are not mukallaf (accountable) kaafirs. Again, Abu Aswad, you’ve been around long enough to know that there are MANY people calling themselves Muslims who are mixed up and jacked up in the matters of the Creed. You are silent about that. You know why? Because you know the deviants don’t agree EVEN ON THE MATTERS OF THE CORE OF THE CREED. Your objective is to “unite” people who call themselves “Muslim” on a black platform–your objective is not to unite people on the `Aqidah. And given that to be the case, again, i ask, where is the sincerity?
Daud,
Thanks, I will try to look for those books and give them a read. I do want to learn from scholars and the proper way. I am not going to say the people I have met have been bad, it is just they don’t seem to know much. Sometimes they will try to explain things to me, and it makes no sense at all. I am in no position to judge anyone though, because I am in the very early stages of trying to learn.
B-more ayah 30-22…..Surah rum…in tafseer-ibn katheer…it mentions how people differ in colors etc…..it isnt a license for you to go and make a ruling to practice “black history month” ….You didnt include any TAFSEER …or any reputable scholar to defend your nonsense “B-MUSA.”…of calling people to increasing their nationalistic, and racial pride so they can have hope and courage to stand in the world…”I am somebody” a bunch of nonsense is what it is if your not a muslim you are NOBODY…pride and nationalism and racism are all things that haraam in islam….The Prophet said: Whoever comes with the calls of Jahileeyah…Then let him bite the head of his father’s penis(sahih adabul mufrad)….and he said:Indeed Allah the exalted has removed form you the arrogance and pride of jahileeyah and it’s boasting of lineage,there are of 2 types a pious god-fearing believer or a miserable sinner….(ahmad)Unlizzted2009
Who from the black nationalists can bring something from black history that will help us into Paradise, or save us from Hell?–that’s the question!
the self appointed Shaykh ul-ridaada wa takfir says “Where is the sincerity, Abu Aswad–i have asked you what is wrong with the content of what i said? What is your issue with me? That i am correct–but i happen to be a little harsh? Okay, i am not going to be “polite” with those who are misguiding others. Perhaps some others will defend the Truth in a softer tone. As long as they defend the Truth, i don’t have a problem with that.”
my response is simply before the salaf would learn from a person, they would first observe his adab and his salaat, and his condition. Only then would they receive ilm from him. on the basis that you haven’t even cross the first threshold of adab the content of whatever you have to say doesn’t even warrant futher comment — khalas.
To be clear for everyone else my objective is to worship Allah, calling to tawheed is another objective.
Neither of these objectives entail rejecting cultural identity. Calling people to tawheed upon the correct the aqidah by first expressing hatred for a people is not the Sunnah of our beloved Prophet (saws) nor will it ever be successful in bringing the people from error.
Now & Then,
A Return to Black Religion
In the old days. . .
The Black man was god, and the Black woman was our moon and stars.
When we walked the street with the red bow ties, selling Final Calls to passing cars.
We use to demand respect, we felt like we were doing something.
Now a days. . .
We know the truth, but we are doing nothing.
Protesting about Palestine, while niggas blood spill in the street.
We lost our rhythem, we’re loosing our beat.
In the old days. . .
We had stores, shops, trucks, and industry for our Black Nation.
We taught our people how to defend themselves against outer frustration.
Now a days. . .
We teach Arabic, and wear our beards and head coverings.
Instead of knowledge of self, NOW it is how to be an Arab we’re discovering.
How can you want four wives, and you can’t take the first one off the food stamps?
Looks like a religious pimp, the lady and the tramp.
In the old days. . .
Their beliefs were false, but their actions were right and exact.
Now we found true religion and now we don’t know how to act.
If you want a revolution, we have to get back to the people. . . where we came from.
Let our heart beat again to the Nigga drum.
Door to door, face to face, giving to the poor.
Where they don’t have to fill out a zakat slip, our stand in line for government assistance no more.
Let’s visit the nursing homes, help the orphans, be a mentor to someone.
Let’s employ our people, and take away the gun.
Maybe we can then save our daughters & sons.
As-salaamu alaikum.
Peace
Marcus
Black History is composed of two words, Black & History. Black is the colour of our people, and History is the events of our past. We have Black History to say - Black people exist, we have a past, we have contributed to civilization. This should not be minimized with religious overtures. As if the natural state that Allah created them in was Islamic, instead of Black. I was born Black then converted to Islam. If Islam is the natural religion (See Surah 30:30), It should come to us as we are & where we are- as naturally Black.
Allah has revealed:
“The Prophet has a greater claim on the faithful than they have on themselves, and his wives are (as) their mothers; and the possessors of relationship have the better claim in the ordinance of Allah to inheritance, one with respect to another, than believers, and those who have fled (Muhajir), except that you do some good to your friends; this is written in the Book.” [QK 33:6]
I don’t know if it can be any clearer. Indeed, you are to do good to friends and others. But, we all have a primary responsibility to our members of the same ethno-blood lines which comes “first” even over the responsibilities that we have to “believers” and those that “struggle” along with us in the cause of justice. Now, this need not be seen in a “racial” sense, but certainly speaks to realities of “blood relationships”. And when it comes to blood relationships, Allah has informed us that we have indeed been created as different nations and tribes which means we were created in a racial-ethnic context. Therefore, we cannot speak of the Divine Universal of Justice, outside of the context that ALLAH created us in! Meaning, you cannot speak of “Justice” by protecting one not of your blood relationship while you have knowledge that your mother, aunt, or sister are being molested and oppressed! That is the point of Black History, to remember our accomplishment, and remind us of our responsibilities, and warn us of our past mistakes.
Allah has revealed:
“And one of His signs is the creation of the heavens and the earth and the diversity of your tongues and colors; most surely there are signs in this for the learned.” [QK 30:2 2]
“O you men! surely We have created you of a male and a female, and made you tribes and families that you may know each other; surely the most honourable of you with Allah is the one among you most careful (of his duty); surely Allah is Knowing, Aware.” [QK 49.13]
However, by these ayaat Allah makes it very clear that we are not simply created as “individuals” or as “Muslims”; We are different tribes and families, which is made evident by our different colours and tongues and languages. So, throw out the notion of race as being something that is not indentified through “science”. That still leaves us with the reality that we are DIFFERENT nations and families or DIFFERENT colours and languages. So, how do we as humans identify ourselves? Or otherwise stated, how do we give definition to these differences? If we cannot define these differences, and don’t know what our differences are, or act and think as if these differences do not exist, then how can others “KNOW US”? If we do not have a name for our unique nation, family, and language, then we do not know and are not known. We become irrelevant.
And in the U.S., despite the election of Mr. Obama, statistics will bear witness that all the different tribes and families or different cultural groups in America are still not equal. And there are indeed certain “markers” if we do want to call them “racial markers” by which these inequalities manifest themselves. Not individually, but collectively. A simple example may suffice; individually a “black” person may be wealthier than a “white” person. But the measure of “wealth” is not defined by one “black” individually, or collectively, but by “whites” collectively, as evident by their control of certain financial institutions and the “markers” given to their currency by which wealth is measured i.e. $1 = Washington, $ 2 = Jefferson, $5 = Lincoln, $10 = Hamilton, $20 = Jefferson, $50 = Grant and $100 = Franklin. Therefore not only do we need to know our Black History we got to keep making history by changing the culture of America.
Allah has revealed:
Surah [47.10] Have they not then journeyed in the land and seen how was the end of those before them: Allah brought down destruction upon them, and the unbelievers shall have the like of it.
Allah also enjoins not only to look at our history but look at the history of other people and evaluate their end and learn from their mistakes. If we are enjoined to look at the history of others, we cannot look at our own history and say it is irrelevant? Nonsense… History is best qualified to reward our research. I would rather people look our history and say – these people came thru a lot and they accomplished a lot, and that thru them America saw a just and correct model of Islam. And that would be BLACK HISTORY.
Ma-salaama….
Marcus
The scholars of Islaam explain the tactics the people of innovation and desires use to misguide people. Mallgo used one of them in his post. NOTE: MALLGO IS NOT AN INNOVATOR BECAUSE HE DOES NOT UNDERSTAND THE ISSUE AND A SCHOLAR HAS NOT CLARIFIED IT TO HIM.
What they do is concoct a a belief foreign to Islaam, and then run to the texts looking for something to support it. Occasionally the find something they can use, but it ALWAYS winds up being a proof AGAINST them; not for them. In this case Mallgo came up with the foreign ideology of partisanship based upon race, and then used an Ayah to support it (33:6). Akhi, you can’t go around making up your own interpretation of the Book of Allaah. Ibn Kathir (rahimahullaah) said in his tafsir of 33:6..
Ibn Kathir
(And blood relations among each other have closer personal ties in the decree of Allah than the believers and the Muhajirin, ) This is an abrogation of the rule that existed previously, whereby they could inherit from one another by virtue of the oath of brotherhood among them. Ibn `Abbas and others said: “A Muhajir would inherit from an Ansari even though they were not related by blood, because of the brotherhood established between them by the Messenger of Allah .” This was also stated by Sa`id bin Jubayr and others among scholars of the earlier and later generations.
Clearly the Ayah was talking specifically about inheritance, not general dealings with one another, so the Ayah you cited does not mean what your trying to make it mean!!!
Regarding dealings with the kuffar–and in this case the black ones—Allaah said
3:118 O you who believe! Take not as (your) Bitânah (advisors, consultants, protectors, helpers, friends, etc.) those outside your religion (pagans, Jews, Christians, and hypocrites) since they will not fail to do their best to corrupt you. They desire to harm you severely. Hatred has already appeared from their mouths, but what their breasts conceal is far worse. Indeed We have made plain to you the Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses) if you understand.
Allaah also said:
58:22 You (O Muhammad SAW) will not find any people who believe in Allâh and the Last Day, making friendship with those who oppose Allâh and His Messenger (Muhammad SAW ), even though they were their fathers, or their sons, or their brothers, or their kindred (people). For such He has written Faith in their hearts, and strengthened them with Rûh (proofs, light and true guidance) from Himself. And We will admit them to Gardens (Paradise) under which rivers flow, to dwell therein (forever). Allâh is pleased with them, and they with Him. They are the Party of Allâh. Verily, it is the Party of Allâh that will be the successful.
@Usamah
First of all, Usamah, since you claim to follow traditional scholarship, well, the scholars of the Madhaahib wrote extensively on the matters of apostasy. If someone says explicit kufr, like a Louis Farrakhan, you can’t hesitate on the kufr of such a person. Among the examples of apostasy is the one who knowingly belies the Qur’an. Also, mentioned as kufr is the claim of the legitimacy of other religions besides Islam. EVERY MUSLIM agrees on the kufr of such people. If they don’t, then they are not Muslim. So i have not made takfeer on other than what is clear cut unambiguous kufr–which the Ummah has consensus.
Just keep in mind that when Ash-Shafi`iyy debated Hafs ul-Fard (a leading Mu`tazilah), he called the man a kaafir to his face. According to your ill-logic, you wouldn’t take from Ash-Shafi`iyy, either. Okay now that that matter is clear, other than what you may consider poor adaab with deviants, what have i said that was wrong? Again, is it not the case that the `Ulamaa’ told us that the one who belies the Qur’an or deems Christianity a legitimate religion is a kaafir? And is it not the case that the `Ulamaa’ (and i am talking about mainstream scholars–not folks you might want to label as “extremists”) said that the mukallaf kaafir is condemned to Hell? And is it not the case that the `Ulamaa’ warned the public and CONDEMNED THOSE DEVIANTS OPENLY–and very often in very harsh terms?
If you want to call people to Tawheed, well, you also have to warn people against WHAT IS NOT TAWHEED–especially given that we live in an era and a place where kufr is prevalent. Also, Muslims are OBLIGATED TO HATE EVIL–and there is no greater evil than kufr. The Prophet did not go to war with the mushriks because he “loved” them.
Abu Usamah, you do understand that you are being set up by these quasi-traditionalist? They want to pretend that they are presenting mainstream classical Islam–when in reality THEY ARE APOLOGISTS. They are (Irshad) Manji’ites dressed in the Sunnah. They want to obliterate the notion of ordering the good and forbidding the evil (to the point they even signed a mutual agreement amongst themselves not to speak about each others deviance). They want to slowly feed deviant notions into the Deen (such as claiming Allah has children). They don’t want to say clearly and unambiguously that the mukallaf kaafir is condemned to Hell. And FOR SURE they want to OBLITERATE the Baabir-Riddah (the Chapter of Apostasy) from the minds of the Muslims, so that no one will call them out on their kufr. THIS is the Cheryl Benard/Rand Report Agenda–and you’re on it whether or not you know it.
Someone just sent me this narration about enjoining the good and forbidding evil:
Uways ibn ‘Aamir (radhiyallaahu ‘anhu) said:
“The act of ordering what is right and forbidding evil does not leave the believer with a single friend. We order them with what is good and they insult our honor, and they get help from the faasiqoon (disobedient, rebellious ones) in that, so much so that, by Allaah, they have accused me of horrible things. But, by Allaah, I will not stop establishing His Right amongst them.”
Al-I’tisaam (1/39)
Does “forbidding evil” also mean being a self righteous and belligerent maniac?
Where do you people get this belief that someone is “self-righteous” because he or she tells you to fear Allaah, or advises you? This an incredibly false belief that will do nothing but lead you to doom and destruction in this life and in the nex!!!. You’ll rarely find someone who forbids evil–and let it be known that in Islaam, forbidding evil takes precedence over enjoining good–doing it because he wants to put his brother down or ridicule him; rather he’s trying to uplift his brother and guide him to the correct way!!!!!
Not everyone is fit for giving da’wah and Alhamdulullaah Allaah made it fard kifayyah on the common Muslim. There are two issues that we should consider that involve advising each other: how someone gives the advise; and how one takes the advice.
Yes, back in the day we made many mistakes, and some of us still continue to do so. Alhamdulullaah, the issue was clarified by the scholars so at least now we have instructions on how to give advice we can refer to. Umar ibn Khattab (radiyyallaahu anhu) advised us in an authentic hadith that we should surround ourselves with companions who point out our faults.
On the other hand, MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY Muslims don’t know how to take advice. They get offended because someone had the audacity to correct them, despite the fact that they are wrong! This is an evil characteristic of the jaahiliyyah that comes from being black folks and americans. We are ignorant and arrogant, and that his a recipe for doom, because it prevents people from taking advice, which is turning away. IT IS NOT PERMISSIBLE FOR A MUSLIM TO TURN AWAY FROM ADVICE. Allaah repeatedly warns those who turn away:
18:57 And who does more wrong than he who is reminded of the Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.) of his Lord, but turns away from them forgetting what (deeds) his hands have sent forth. Truly, We have set veils over their hearts lest they should understand this (the Qur’ân), and in their ears, deafness. And if you (O Muhammad SAW) call them to guidance, even then they will never be guided.
20:48 ‘Truly, it has been revealed to us that the torment will be for him who denies [believes not in the Oneness of Allâh, and in His Messengers, etc.], and turns away.’(from the truth and obedience of Allâh)”
20:124 “But whosoever turns away from My Reminder (i.e. neither believes in this Qur’ân nor acts on its orders, etc.) verily, for him is a life of hardship, and We shall raise him up blind on the Day of Resurrection.”
31:7 And when Our Verses (of the Qur’ân) are recited to such a one, he turns away in pride, as if he heard them not, as if there were deafness in his ear. So announce to him a painful torment.
43:36 And whosoever turns away (blinds himself) from the remembrance of the Most Beneficent (Allâh) (i.e. this Qur’ân and worship of Allâh), We appoint for him Shaitân (Satan devil) to be a Qarîn (an intimate companion) to him.
2:206 And when it is said to him, “Fear Allâh”, he is led by arrogance to (more) crime. So enough for him is Hell, and worst indeed is that place to rest!
This is just a sample of he MANY Ayaat where Allaah warns people, including the Muslims, from turning away from the truth.
Yes, sometimes the advisor is a jerk. But, sometimes the advisee is the jerk. O Muslims, when someone advises you; you have a decision to make. Either take the advise and change, or continue on the path that will lead you to destruction. The bottom line is that when the truth comes to you, you must submit to it, even if it is bitter for you. You can not reject it because “I don’t like how he’s bringing it”, or “she was harsh to me”, or any of the reasons or excuses people use to turn away from obedience to Allaah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Its amazing to me how people out one side of their mouth spout Quran without tafsir chide others for doin the same thing out the other side.
When someone brings proof from Quran as to how Allah commands to discuss differences with each other and with non-Muslim or the example the Prophet (saws) conduct in disputation is provided, we are hit with well Shaykh so n so or Imam Fulan Fulan was harsh.
back to central point of do we need a Black history month, I say NO. We must make the accurate preservation and transmission a MAJOR priority throughout the whole year, to be taken up by at least a few in the community. And everyone must learn their lineage and if it unknown then you must investigate it.
Despite what the pawns say no ayat has been revealed preventing the poor and oppressed from learning, acknowledging and preserving their history and lineage.
Particularly in the case of Blackamericans who’s lineage, history and accomplishments were stolen and hidden.
Knowledge is the lost possesion of the believers, we are obligated to seek it.
1) Loving your own people is not bigotry.
2) Calling your own people to Islam is not bigotry.
3) Learning of your lineage is not bigotry
4) Preserving history and literature of even non-Muslim ancestors is not bigotry.
Lastly although there were Persians and Blacks amongst the Prophet (saws) why is that every hadith which I’ve been taught or read about that deals with bigotry was directed at the Arabs of so-called nobility for either rallying their tribe to FIGHT and KILL one another (not ralling to Islam) or due to their bigotry towards a Black Muslim or other non-Arab Muslims, with the exception one which was revealed about a harsh Arab of common ancestry showing bigotry towards a Black Muslim.
Where is the TAFSIR of an ayat or SHARH of hadith which was revealed rebuking the non-Arab for speaking directly to their people? It was the Arab nobles who were the bigots and certain ayat were revealed to protect the poor and oppressed from Arab nobles.
Unfortunately, this same bigotry still infects the Arab lands to a degree (no not everyone in whole societies), and is being exported to the US in the guise of true Islamthe proof is that while, the Prophet (saws) said “do not call anyone abd…” not simply don’t call each other bad names but specifically he prohibited calling people “abd” yet in Every Arab land this is exactly what they call Black people.
Shaykh Abdul Azziz inbul Baaz (rahimahullaah), from his “Refutation of Arab Nationalism”…
Islaam has forbidden the calls of jaahiliyyah (the prelslaamic days of ignorance) and there are many textual evidences which forbid all of the characteristics and manners of jaahiliyyah and their actions, except those (good and decent) practices which Isl aam agreed to. And there is no doubt that the call to nationalism is from these calls of jaahiliyyah, since nationalism is a call to other than Islaam and an aiding of other than the truth. And how many ills, evils and serious wars has such calls of jaahi liyyah caused to their people, causing great harm to their souls, their wealth and their possessions.
The consequences of such calls (for the Muslims) was a splitting up of their unity and a planting of enmity and hatred of each other in their hearts and a fragmentation and splitting between tribes and nations.
Shaykh Abdul Azziz inbul Baaz (rahimahullaah), from his “Refutation of Arab Nationalism”…
…And there is no doubt that the call to nationalism is a call to ‘asabiyyah (partisanship and party spirit) and it is a call to becoming angry for the sake of ‘asabiyyah and fighting for ‘asabiyyah. And there is no doubt also, that the call to nationalism is a call to transgression, pride and arrogance, since nationalism is not a divinely revealed way of life which prevents its people from oppression and proud boasting. Rather it is an ideology from the time of jaahiliyyah which leads its people to boasting about it and having ‘asabiyyah for it even if they are the oppressors and the others are the oppressed ! So O noble reader consider this and the truth will be clear to you.
And from the textual evidences connected with this is what at-Tirmidhee relates from Allaah’s Messenger sallallaahu ‘alayhi wa sallam that he said:
“Let people stop boasting about their forefathers who have died, who are merely fuel for the Hell Fire; or they will certainly be more insignificant with Allaah than the beetle which roles dung with its nose. Allaah has removed from you the party spirit of the days of jaahiliyyah and the boasting about one’s forefathers. Indeed a person is either a pious Believer or a wretched sinner. All of mankind are the children of Aadaam, and Aadam was created from clay.”
How can anybody have anything to say after this!?!
Where is the TAFSIR of an ayat or SHARH of hadith which was revealed rebuking the non-Arab for speaking directly to their people?
@Daud
How is any of what you just cut and pasted at odds with what I wrote? Please explain.
I agree with what Shaykh Bin Baz wrote and applaud him for trying to reign in the ignorance of his people too bad the Arabs don’t heed him. To show how the Arabs have totally disregarded what he wrote the Saudi Nationalism Day is still celebrated, a day in which much partying and boasting of Arab and Saudi lineage takes place how much of a slap in the face can that be? And Blacks are still openly refered to as abd, so I agree there is much too be taught to the Arabs, to whom that hadith was revealed..
But stay focused what does that have to do with what I wrote?
Where I have called for boasting, fighting or killing of other Muslims based on tribe? Where have I rallied my against other Muslims? Where have I insulted or offened the mothers of other Muslims?
I further agree that those Arabs who believe they have fahdl over others due to lineage or the works of their ancestors as well as the non-Arabs who believe and accept it are steeped in ignorance.
Now, for the benefit of the other bloggers can please can you provide the circumstances and occasion the hadith you just posted was revealed? Since you were the one who posted it and I know you are keen about supplying dalil. Btw, I already know.
What hadith are you referring to?
Allaahs Messenger sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam that he said:
Let people stop boasting about their forefathers who have died, who are merely fuel for the Hell Fire; or they will certainly be more insignificant with Allaah than the beetle which roles dung with its nose. Allaah has removed from you the party spirit of the days of jaahiliyyah and the boasting about ones forefathers. Indeed a person is either a pious Believer or a wretched sinner. All of mankind are the children of Aadaam, and Aadam was created from clay.
I’m surprised so many African American Muslims were just giddy about voting for Obama and his win. He was part of racist black nationalist kafir church for over 20 years. That would be like me voting for David Duke. Obama also wants to send more troops to Afghanistan, and has talked about attacking Pakistan, another Muslim country. The first person he picked for his cabinet was a racist Jew, Rahm Emanuel, a former Israeli Defense Force (IDF) volunteer. We all know how the IDF treats Muslims. For the record I didn’t vote for anyone is the presidential election.
Dear acquaintances,
I greet you in peace! As-salaamu alaikum.
This is some interesting commentary.
Let’s become acquainted with the source of all knowledge, namely Allah. What did Allah say about tafsirs?
Allah revealed:
Al-Furqan
وَلَا يَأْتُونَكَ بِمَثَلٍ إِلَّا جِئْنَاكَ بِالْحَقِّ وَأَحْسَنَ تَفْسِيرًا
Wala yatoonaka bimathalin illa jinaka bialhaqqi waahsana tafseeran
[QK 25:33] “And no question do they bring to thee but We reveal to thee the truth and the best explanation (thereof).”
Mathal (”question”) signifies “a description, state, or case”, and is metaphorically applied to “a state or condition” that is “strange or wonderful” (See Lanes Lexicon) , or it means “hujjat” i.e., an argument (See Taj al ‘Aroos - dictionary). The meaning is that they -the disbelievers - can not bring a strange question or strong objection which has not been answered in the Holy Quran with truth, and of which the best explanation is not given therein. This verse lays down the basis for searching for tafsirs……viz., that the Holy Quran not only contains answers to ALL objections against it, but also adduces arguments of truth of assertions made. No other religious book of the world satisfies this requirement, which circumstance alone places the Quran above all scriptures, and points to itself as a unique revelation capable of satisfying the spiritual requirements of all men in all times. Did not the Quran say that it’s made easy to understand (V11:1, V41:3, V41:44, V54:17, V54:22, V54:32, V54:40 and in many other places) so no one is allowed to divert it’s literal meaning.
The main problem with the tafsirs of the scholars - especially those based on tradition…they are numerous and often contradict each other. So some Muslims pick the scholars & tafsirs that fit their ideological world view. For example, commentators feel fairly sure of the exact circumstances prompting some verses, such as surat Iqra, or many parts, including ayat 190-194, of surat al-Baqarah. In other cases (eg surat al-Asr), the most that can be said is which city Muhammad was living in at the time (dividing between Meccan and Medinan suras.) In some cases, such as surat al-Kawthar, the details of the circumstances are disputed, with different traditions giving different accounts. Therefore, I feel the Quran is the first place we should look for understanding, then science, history, and lastly reason.
There are various approaches to interpret the Qur’an–
* Interpretation of the Qur’an by the Qur’an: Because of the close interrelatedness of the verses of the Qur’an with one another, the Qur’anic verses explain and interpret one another. Many verses or words in the Qur’an are explained or further clarified in other verses of the Qur’an. Tafsir al-Mizan is an example of this kind.
* Interpretation of the Qur’an by the Hadith: In this approach the most important external aids used in interpreting the meanings of the Qur’an are the hadith — the collected oral traditions upon which Muslim scholars (the ulema) based Islamic history and law. While certain hadith — the hadith qudsi — are thought to reflect non canonical words spoken by God to Muhammad, Muslims do not consider these to form any part of the Qur’an.
* Interpretation of the Qur’an by the History: Most commentators considered it extremely important for commentators to explain how the Qur’an was revealed — when and under which circumstances. Much commentary, or tafsir, was dedicated to history. The early tafsir are considered to be some of the best sources for Islamic history. Famous early commentators include at-Tabari and Ibn Kathir.
(These classic commentaries usually include all common and accepted interpretations; modern fundamentalist commentaries like that written by Sayyed Qutb tend to advance only one of the possible interpretations.)
*Theologies approach: Theologists are divided into myriad of sects; and each group clung to the verse that seems to support its belief and try to explain away what was apparently against it.
The seed of sectarian differences was sown in academic theories or, more often than not, in blind following and national or tribal prejudice; but it is not the place to describe it even briefly. However, such exegesis should be called adaptation, rather than interpretation. There are two ways of interpreting a verse - One may say: “What does the Qur’an say?” Or one may say: “How can this verse be explained, so as to fit on my belief? ” The difference between the two approaches is quite clear. The former forgets every preconceived idea and goes where the Qur’an leads him to. The latter has already decided what to believe and cuts the Qur’anic verses to fit on that body; such an exegesis is no exegesis at all.
* Philosophic approach: The philosophers try to fit the verses on the principles of Greek philosophy (that was divided into four branches: Mathematics, natural science, divinity and practical subjects including civics). If a verse was clearly against those principles it was explained away. In this way the verses describing metaphysical subjects, those explaining the genesis and creation of the heavens and the earth, those concerned with life after death and those about resurrection, paradise and hell were distorted to conform with the said philosophy. That philosophy was admittedly only a set of conjectures - unencumbered with any test or proof; but the Muslim philosophers felt no remorse in treating its views on the system of skies, orbits, natural elements and other related subjects as the absolute truth with which the exegesis of the Qur’an had to conform.
* Scientific approach: Some people who are deeply influenced by the natural and social sciences followed the materialists of Europe or the pragmatists. Under the influence of those secular theories, they declared that the religion’s realities cannot go against scientific knowledge. one should not believe except that which is perceived by any one, of the five senses; nothing exists except the matter and its properties. What the religion claims to exist, but which the sciences reject -like The Throne, The Chair, The Tablet and The Pen - should be interpreted in a way that conforms with the science; as for those things which the science is silent about, like the resurrection etc., they should be brought within the purview of the laws of matter; the pillars upon which the divine religious laws are based - like revelation, angel, Satan, prophethood, apostleship, Imamah (Imamate) etc. - are spiritual things, and the spirit is a development of the matter, or let us say, a property of the matter; legislation of those laws is manifestation of a special social genius, who ordains them after healthy and fruitful contemplation, in order to establish a good and progressive society. They believe one cannot have confidence in the traditions, because many are spurious; only those traditions may be relied upon which are in conformity with the Book. As for the Book itself, one should not explain it in the light of the old philosophy and theories, because they were not based on observations and tests - they were just a sort of mental exercise which has been totally discredited now by the modem science.
* Sufistic: It’s an interpretation of the Qur’an which includes attribution of esoteric or mystic meanings to the text by the interpreter. In this respect, its method is different from the conventional exegesis of the Qur’an, called tafsir. Esoteric interpretations do not usually contradict the conventional (in this context called exoteric) interpretations; instead, they discuss the inner levels of meaning of the Qur’an. A hadith from Muhammad which states that the Qur’an has an inner meaning, and that this inner meaning conceals a yet deeper inner meaning, and so on (up to seven levels of meaning), has sometimes been used in support of this view. Islamic opinion imposes strict limitations on esoteric interpretations specially when interior meaning is against exterior one.
Esoteric interpretations are found mainly in Sufism and in the sayings (hadiths) of Shi’a Imams and the teachings of the Isma’ili sect. But the Prophet and the imams gave importance to its exterior as much as to its interior; they were as much concerned with its revelation as they were with its interpretation.
Some Muslims believe that it is prohibited to perform Qur’anic interpretation using solely one’s own opinion. This, they base on an authenticated hadith of Muhammad which states that it is prohibited.
Imam al-Ghazali qualifies this tradition, with the following understanding:
“The truth is that prophetic Traditions (akhbar) and statements of the Prophet’s companions and of other pious Muslims in early Islam (athar) prove that ‘for men of understanding there is wide scope in the meanings of the Qur’an’. Thus ‘Ali (may God be pleased with him!) said, ‘except that God bestows understanding of the Qur’an upon a man.’ If there is no meaning other than that which is related [from Ibn 'Abbas and other exegetes] what is that understanding of the Qur’an [which is bestowed upon a man]? The Prophet (may God bless him and greet him) said, ‘Surely the Qur’an has an outward aspect, an inward aspect, a limit and a prelude.’ This is also related by Ibn Mas’ud on his own authority and he is one of the scholars of Qur’anic interpretation. [If there are no meanings of the Qur'an besides the outward ones], what is the meaning of its outward aspect, inward aspect, limit and prelude? ‘Ali (may God show regard to his face!) said, ‘If I so will I can certainly load seventy camels with the exegesis of the Opening Sura of the Book.’ What then is the meaning of this statement of ‘Ali, when the outward exegesis of this sura is extremely short [and can be set forth in a few pages]? Abu Darda’ said, ‘One cannot [fully] understand the religion until one sees the Qur’an from different perspectives.’ A certain religious scholar said, ‘For every Qur’anic verse there are sixty thousand understandings [comprehensible to man]. The understandings of it which remain [incomprehensible to man] are even more than these in number.’ (See Sayyed Qutb - In the Shade of the Qur’an)
The Qur’an, the utmost authority on Islam asserts that the word was sent to all of mankind and it is up to the whole of mankind to receive it and sincerely ponder upon its meaning. Islam acknowledges no “clergy” nor monopolization of “The Word of Allah (swt) i.e God”, Sunni Muslims only acknowledges the “knowledgeable” ones from among a community of people, the “Ulama” or scholars if they are known and famous for their faith. In the Qur’an, Allah i.e. God exhorts mankind to “think” and “ponder” and “realize” for themselves, thereby awakening true belief inside each and every human being.
Now for the verses you so eloquently described, using Ibn Kathir’s interpretation (and that is what it is, his understanding) in your comments. And now allow the Quran -.i.e. Allah speak for himself……..
Allah has revealed:
[QK 33:6] “The Prophet has a greater claim on the faithful than they have on themselves, and his wives are (as) their mothers; and the possessors of relationship have the better claim in the ordinance of Allah to inheritance, one with respect to another, than believers, and those who have fled (Muhajir), except that you do some good to your friends; this is written in the Book.”
Let’s highlight the phrase: “possessors of relationship”…
I, Mallgo, said: “Indeed, you are to do good to friends and others. But, we all have a primary responsibility to our members of the same ethno-blood lines which comes “first” even over the responsibilities that we have to “believers” and those that “struggle” along with us in the cause of justice. Now, this need not be seen in a “racial” sense, but certainly speaks to realities of “blood relationships”. And when it comes to blood relationships, Allah has informed us that we have indeed been created as different nations and tribes which means we were created in a racial-ethnic context. Therefore, we cannot speak of the Divine Universal of Justice, outside of the context that ALLAH created us in! Meaning, you cannot speak of “Justice” by protecting one not of your blood relationship while you have knowledge that your mother, aunt, or sister are being molested and oppressed! That is the point of Black History, to remember our accomplishment, and remind us of our responsibilities, and warn us of our past mistakes.”
I related “possessors of relationship” to “ethno-blood lines”,” blood relationships”, and family members, i.e. your mother, aunt, or sister.
Let’s look at some other verses:
Allah revealed:
[QK 8:75] And those who accept Faith subsequently, and adopt exile, and fight for the Faith in your company,- they are of you. But kindred by blood have prior rights against each other in the Book of Allah. Verily Allah is well-acquainted with all things.
Obviously, when the Muslims first came to Medina, a brotherhood was established between those who fled (Muhajir) and the helpers (Ansars), and according to Arab custom, they could receive a share of the inheritance upon the death of the other. Surah 33:6 Abolishes this custom and allowing inheritance only to actual relatives or kindred.
The Quran uses the word for Kindred “alarham” and other places it uses the word “Qurba” both meaning, according to Lane’s Lexicon, “near and relationship on the female side”! The significance of which is relationship by or through the “womb”. This can be your actual BLOOD brothers and sisters, or if broaden a little more – the children of your grandmother and their children (cousins, nieces, and nephews), and if we broaden a bit further it could mean those that share a most recent common matrilineal ancestor via Mitochondrial DNA , i.e. “ethno-blood lines” related to an particular ethnic group. We are told in Surah An-Nisa to have “Taqwa” of the “womb” because it is that “womb” which nurtures us. And therefore, Surah 8:75 suggests even strangers who have accepted Islam and fled from their homes become “of you”, however - those who have in addition ties of blood relationship, possess every title to have their interest guarded by the Muslim community. We have thrown this part of the deen behind our backs because we label these blood/ethnic relationships as Kufar. We pride ourselves in our Islamic studies and rallies for Palestine, while ignoring the needs of our own community, even members of our own immediate families. Shame on you.
Allah has revealed:
[QK 2:215] “They ask thee what they should spend. Say: Whatever ye spend that is good, is for parents and kindred and orphans and those in want and for wayfarers. And whatever ye do that is good, -(Allah) knoweth it well.”
Ma-salaama,
Marcus
Assalaam Alaikum,
This post is not directed at anyone in particular but is intended to put another perspective on the question if Black History month should continue.
I am on the side of the discussion that Black History month should continue. I embrace the month for historical and cultural reasons and as a Muslim I see no conflict understanding and studying my cultural heritage. I also embrace and support events like Asian-Pacific Heritage month, Latino Heritage Month, Woman’s History Month, etc…. Frankly, if someone wanted to have a European History Month, I would have no problem with that either, although, many would argue that the way history is taught to us in the American public school system is, by definition, European History. This is one of the reasons we have Black History month in the first place. I don’t see that as boasting and the intent is not to raise one group over another, the intent is to highlight the contributions the many groups that have influenced America and the world. In Al-Islam, our actions are judged by intentions.
As many have reminded us, Allah has stated in the Holy Qur’an:
49:13 O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female and made you into nations and tribes that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise each other). Verily the most honored of you in the sight of Allah is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things).
30:22 And among His Signs is the creation of the heavens and the earth and the variations in your languages and your colors: verily in that are Signs for those who know.
I have often marveled at the wisdom of Al-Hikmah (one of the names of the Qur’an) for such ayah in a world that because of technology is much more interdependent. Therefore, there is an increasingly urgent need to see our common humanity within our diversity in order to solve problems that affect the world. While there is no Caliphate, the world wide function to establish justice, which I believe that office is to effect is always needed.
2: 143 Thus have We made of you an Ummah justly balanced that ye might be witnesses over the nations and the Apostle a witness over yourselves….
I do not believe it is possible to practice Al-Islam outside of some cultural context and no Muslim people in history have ever embraced Al-Islam and terminated their cultural distinctiveness. Not the Arabs, Turks, Mandingoes, Persians….no one. Most continued to speak their native language while at the same time learning Qur’anic Arabic for religious purposes. Although Arabic continues to be one of the major world languages, most of its speakers do speak Fusha and speak dialects that are often mutually incomprehensible. In my opinion, to deny our diversity, is to deny Allah’s creative power, will, attributes and the specifically revealed ayah in the Qur’an dealing with these issues.
I have to say that, in my opinion, only Negroes, people that have been programmed for self hate, would even seriously consider the notion or would sit at the feet of people to learn the Deen and not see that many times these people, however well intentioned, are teaching a perspective of Al-Islam that is influenced by their cultural context. This is why you have 2nd and 3rd generation Muslims in America whose parents emigrated from abroad looking to develop Imams that understand the American context.
I am reading the book, “Black Pilgrimage to Islam” by Robert Dannin. Here is the link: http://islamicbookstore.com/b6968.html He says, “In the 14 centuries since the Prophet Muhammad lived, Islam has radiated from its center of origin on the Arabia peninsula to Africa, Asia Minor, Europe, and further into Asia by various means, including military conquest, political, commercial and cultural hegemony. African-Americans have sought out and devised a unique path to this religion.” In my opinion, that unique path is a function of the particular history of African people in America.
Now back to Black History Month. This is an event that is celebrated around the world; not just in America. As most of us know, it was started by Carter G. Woodson as one of the many initiatives to combat racism and to correct the misunderstanding that people of African descent had made no contribution to world civilization.
This is one of my favorite videos on Black History Month:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLaiU0EtAw4
The Prophet Muhammad is reported to have said, while addressing some Arab’s desire to engage in discussion regarding ethnic pride, “Those who were the best in the pre-lslamic period of ignorance will be the best in Islam provided they comprehend the religious knowledge” After passing through my personal “Afro-Centric” phase on the way to Al-Islam, I have yet to see any word that best describes the struggle of Black people for the ability for self determination in a manner that is pleasing to Allah as Jihad. Black people have had to struggle on every level of human activity including but not limited to physiological, sociological, psychological, economic, militarily. While I believe the election of Barack Hussein Obama is cause of great celebration, I do not believe that racism and other forms of ethnic or gender superiority have somehow been eradicated from the American and worldwide human dynamic because of his election To me, the ability to celebrate our diversity, consistent with Allah’s guidance to mankind in the Qur’an, helps in the on-going struggle against these forms of injustice. In my opinion, not dealing directly with the world wide reality of racism and other “isms” is naïve.
I understand the Prophet to have said that it is not nationalism (which is haraam) to love your people, it is nationalism to support them in wrong doing. I understand further that tribal boast is allowed in Al-Islam during Jihad as the Prophet himself employed it.
Sahih Al-Bukhari Hadith
Hadith 5.605 Narrated by
Abu Ishaq
I heard Al-Bara’ narrating when a man came and said to him, “O Abu ‘Umara! Did you flee on the day (of the battle) of Hunain?” Al-Bara’ replied, “I testify that the Prophet did not flee, but the hasty people hurried away and the people of Hawazin threw arrows at them. At that time, Abu Sufyan bin Al-Harith was holding the white mule of the Prophet by the head, and the Prophet was saying, “I am the Prophet undoubtedly: I am the son of ‘Abdul-Muttalib.”
Allah has stated in the Holy Qur’an:
22: 40 (They are) those who have been expelled from their homes in defiance of right (for no cause) except that they say “Our Lord is Allah.” Did not Allah check one set of people by means of another there would surely have been pulled down monasteries churches synagogues and mosques in which the name of Allah is commemorated in abundant measure. Allah will certainly aid those who aid His (cause); for verily Allah is Full of Strength Exalted in Might (Able to enforce His Will).
I summary, I believe that it is important for everyone to understand their unique family, cultural, nationalistic history and to use that understanding for mutual respect and peace and justice not for self aggrandizement. I do not see that as inconsistent with the Qur’an or the Sunnah of the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him.
May Allah reward me for my intentions and correct any errors I have made.
Salaam
Dawud Abdur-Rahman
Every one of you posted Ayaat that are actually proofs against your argument.
Robert Dannin ain’t Muslim and he ain’t even black so what does he have to say. I know he don’t know anything about the spread of Islaam; except what he probably got from the orientialists books.
Shaykhul Islaam ibn Taymiyyah (rahimahullaah):
Ibn Taymiyyah (d.728H) rahimahullaah said: [2] “Everything which is outside the call of Islaam and the Qur’aan, with regards to lineage, land, nationality, schools of thoughts and ways, then it is from the calls of jaahiliyyah. lndeed, even when the Muhaajirs (those Companions who migrated from Makkah to Madeenah) and the Ansaars (those Companions who aided and supported those who migrated) argued, such that one of the Muhaajirs said:” O Muhaajirs! (implying; rally to my aid) ” And one of the Ansaar said: “O Ansaar!” Upon hearing this, the Prophet sallallaahu ‘alayhi wa sallam said: “Is it with the calls of Jaahiliyyah that you call, and I am still amongst you!” And he became very angry at that.”[3]
I was going to cut-and-paste more of the statements of Shaykh bin Baaz (rahimahullaah) from his refutation of nationalism (asabiyyah), but there were so many benefits it would have been too long.
http://www.troid.org/dawah/methodology-of-da-wah/the-evils-of-nationalism.html
@Daud
Stay focused one stream of attack at a time, first how are the previous comments you posted about Shaykh Bin Baz (ra) incongruent with what I posted? Either prove it or stop misrepresenting the Shaykh.
While we all are waiting for you to provide the circumstances and occasion the hadith below, you go off on another tangent, again let’s stay focused.
Allaah’s Messenger sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam that he said:
“Let people stop boasting about their forefathers who have died, who are merely fuel for the Hell Fire; or they will certainly be more insignificant with Allaah than the beetle which roles dung with its nose. Allaah has removed from you the party spirit of the days of jaahiliyyah and the boasting about one’s forefathers. Indeed a person is either a pious Believer or a wretched sinner. All of mankind are the children of Aadaam, and Aadam was created from clay.”
Furthermore I made the statments
“Where is the TAFSIR of an ayat or SHARH of hadith which was revealed rebuking the non-Arab for speaking directly to their people? It was the Arab nobles who were the bigots and certain ayat were revealed to protect the poor and oppressed from Arab nobles.”
And
“Where I have called for boasting, fighting or killing of other Muslims based on tribe? Where have I rallied my (tribe) against other Muslims? Where have I insulted or offened the mothers of other Muslims?”
And
“Knowledge is the lost possesion of the believers, we are obligated to seek it.
1) Loving your own people is not bigotry.
2) Calling your own people to Islam is not bigotry.
3) Learning of your lineage is not bigotry
4) Preserving history and literature of even non-Muslim ancestors is not bigotry.”
Prove any of these statements false. Don’t bring proofs against “boasting” (because there is no boasting) nor from your oppinion or how you feel but from Quran and Sunnah.
You have had two days and neither you nor unlizzted have done so, is it because you can’t? Now you are off on another tangent (like a child with ADD) saying “Every one of you posted Ayaat that are actually proofs against your argument” I say, provide the asbab al-nuzul of the ayat if you are truthful.
This is why I stoped posting ayat on blogs because of ignorance like this, eventhough its plain as day people still attempt to twist the meanings.
Lastly I want to say in my oppioion (and I could be wrong) but you seem to be taking talking points from former or current members of the lajnah al-daimah, and since they appear to have the time to give fatawa that you and others seem to be ready to apply to our circumstances here in the USA, as a matter of curiousity can you post their refutation of the Saudi Nationalism Day?
Surely, there must be a major refutation of this innovated (bida) third celebration (eid) whose objective is building national pride? Indeed this could shed light on how they dealt with nationlism and bida in their own country.
I am working on the explanation of the hadith. I have a companion that has scholar’s explanations of the hadith collected by Abu Dawood and At Tirmidhi (rahimahumullaah). We never heard of anything about “rebuking the non-Arab for speaking directly to their people?”, but we’ll research it.
We need to know where you got the part about “rebuking the non-Arab for speaking directly to their people?” from? This can assist us in our research, so name your men.
NOTE: If it came from one of your callers to black nationalism i.e. someone who ain’t really a scholar, and his/her analysis of hadith, than don’t waste our time. If it’s from the sufi deviate ibn khaldun, than don’t waste our time.
Abu Usamah, the problem isn’t nationalism, but racialism where we have seen some Black Muslims clearly favoring non-Muslims from their kind over other Muslims. Also, there is a fatwa against the so-called Saudi National Day signed by many scholars.
Can I have your email contact?
@ Daud
You quote from Ibn Kathir:
Ibn Kathir
(And blood relations among each other have closer personal ties in the decree of Allah than the believers and the Muhajirin, ) This is an abrogation of the rule that existed previously, whereby they could inherit from one another by virtue of the oath of brotherhood among them. Ibn `Abbas and others said: “A Muhajir would inherit from an Ansari even though they were not related by blood, because of the brotherhood established between them by the Messenger of Allah .” This was also stated by Sa`id bin Jubayr and others among scholars of the earlier and later generations.
“Clearly the Ayah was talking specifically about inheritance, not general dealings with one another, so the Ayah you cited does not mean what your trying to make it mean!!!”
Now Daud, you say others quote things to disprove their points. That is the pot calling the kettle black. This “tasfir” only serves as evidence as how one’s obligation to blood relations can not be simply given over EVEN AS A RESULT OF the “Brotherhood” of “non-related” people in Islaam!!! This is even all the more remarkable considering all the tribes involved, for the most part, were Arabs!
You say that it is only talking about “inheritance” and not general dealings as some proof of your argument. It seems you are down playing the importance of inheritance here or are interpreting this ayaah to mean that in all other relationships, it is OK to put those of the Islaamic Brotherhood first, but when it comes to rights of inheritance, bequeathing of WEALTH, only then must blood relations be given first priority. It is of wealth that allows you to obtain for yourself food, clothing, and shelter. Without wealth, or without the possession of something material, you cannot not have any ‘general relationship’ at all because you would be dead!!!
Allah has revealed:
Most surely in the heavens and the earth there are signs for the believers. And in your creation and in what He spreads abroad of animals there are signs for a people that are sure; [QK 45:3-4]
And one of His signs is the creation of the heavens and the earth and the diversity of your tongues and colors; most surely there are signs in this for the learned. [QK 30:22]
“Oh man! surely We have created you of a male and a female, and made you tribes and families that you may know each other; surely the most honorable of you with Allah is the one among you most careful (of his duty); surely Allah is Knowing, Aware.” [QK 49:13]
In our diversity there are signs from Allah. How is it that learning of the history of a people, studying the signs of Allah to “know” a nation or tribe of people haraam?
And you and your cohorts seem to equate “Black history month” with boasting and celebrating pornography, zina, and other acts of munkar. How is teaching someone that a Black person invented the “traffic light” exhorting them to do something haraam?
Again, only those descending from slaves of the Magrhib come up with such notions and can be lead our taught by other to believe that study of their own people or any people for that matter is haraam. Ask your companion and Brother Sawrthmoor who teaches Islaamic history I believe, to educate us about the Abbassids and the Shu-ubbiya. Or, teach us about the Ridda wars or the conquests even, “outside of the context of explaining the involvement of the ARAB TRIBES. Teach us “Islaamic” history without mentioning to us the Barmicides, the Persians, the Tartars, the Kurds, the Seljuq Turks, or the Ottoman Turks. Teach us Islaamic history without mentioning to us the tribes and peoples of Mudar, Yaman, Hanifah, Azd, Kalb, Mahra, Qays, Ummayyah, Hashim, Qahtan, etc.
Islaamic history cannot be taught outside of the context of Allah’s QADR, and that is we have been created as different nations and tribes with different languages and of different colors. Islaamic history is a history of many different people. But despite of the fact that this history may have stories of murdering leaders while praying fajr, a leader or a people having 4 wives, or 50 concubines or right hand possessions, or of leaders swimming in a pool of wine, and all other types of acts, you probably would deem them Islaamic and only protest of these acts when you can attribute them to Blacks now living in America.
Misquote-
I did not mean to say you would deem such acts Islaamic, but such acts would not be deemed as NOT being a part of “Islaamic History”
Bashir,
You allude to something else that has me perplexed. Muslims who descend from the “maghrib” are encouraged to involve themselves in the plight of “Falestine” , “Iraq”, “Afghanistan” etc, yet step of the plane, walk in Saudi, and have someone call them “abeed”.
And what is truly bizare, is how the Akhwan love to call the non-believers “kaffirs”, quote from a Sheik, yet, when members from the “Royal Houses” come to “kaffir” land, they are strolling in front of the “kaffir” White House holding hands with the “kaffir” President!!!
So, if to acknowledge the history and contributions of a people are haraam (not that you are saying that) because they are “Kaffirs”, well don’t acknowledge “kufar”. Meaning, don’t partake of or utilize any contribution of the non-Muslim Kuffar. If it was not invented by we Muslims “1,000″ of years ago in Al-andulus or Baghdad, then don’t acknowledge kufar culture EVERYDAY by your actions. Smash your kufar telephone, your kufar computer, your kufar designed house or apartment (note: a part of your rent payment is set to allow your kufr landord to pay riba), get rid of your kufar automobile, and all the other “luxuries” of the kufar.
My point, you do not have to “Study” something to partake in it or observe it or honor it. You observe culture or honor it everyday by your very living and acting. Calling the non-Muslims “kuffar” is no sign of manhood/womenhood or Islaam. DOING SOMETHING IS!!! Yeah, I know, hate it in your heart and that is the weakest of faith. So is that what the salaf did, go around hating in their hearts? Or did they seek paradise? So, if you really want to prove you point and to be what you think may be “on your deen” then you have ample opportunities to “deal with the kuffar”. Don’t accpet the “weakest” of faith, but seek the “strongest” of faith. And leave to others the task of calling those to the path of Allah with wisdom and good exhortation and by manners which are best, those who walk the earth humble and when the Jahil address them say “Salaam”.
@ Daud,
Assalaam Alaikum,
You wrote, “Robert Dannin ain’t Muslim and he ain’t even black so what does he have to say. I know he don’t know anything about the spread of Islaam; except what he probably got from the orientialists books.”
My dear Brother in Al-Islam. All knowledge is ultimately from Allah, Al-Alim. If the Muslims took the position you seem to have taken, which I believe is inconsistemt with the Qur’an and Sunnah, Al-Andalus, Muslim Spain would not have developed into the enlighted, diverse, Islamic civilization that is admired universally even to this day.
May Allah help us all to be better Muslims.
Salaam
@ unlizzzzzzzzted,
B-more ayah 30-22…..Surah rum…in tafseer-ibn katheer…it mentions how people differ in colors etc…..it isnt a license for you to go and make a ruling to practice “black history month” ….You didnt include any TAFSEER …or any reputable scholar to defend your nonsense “B-MUSA.”…
I am still waiting for you to bring the tasfir or reputable scholar to refute what I said. In posting this ayaat below
Allah has revealed:
And one of His signs is the creation of the heavens and the earth and the diversity of your tongues and colors; most surely there are signs in this for the learned. [QK 30:22]
I did so to say that how can it be haraam to study a sign of Allah??? Again, who is talking about bragging and boasting?
Take note, that many of Allah’s signs are ONLY FOR THE LEARNED!!! Many people, as I think you, take this to mean Signs are only to be taught by someone with a title, given to them by another human being. As such, many think it is haraam to reflect upon the signs of Allah themselves, meaning they have a perception of themselves as being ignorant. As such, they need to be spoon fed and TOLD what to believe.
In fact, as Al-Aswad alludes to, many Muslims get upset when the Qur’aan is quoted because they don’t recognize it! Far too many of us only study Qur’aan for tajweed and tarteel for the purpose of Salaat but we do not use it for guidance primarily. This is why we need to read from “other books” other the Qur’aan, where everything is put into a Chapter or sub-heading where we can go and learn our does and don’ts so we can partake on another culture.
But the Qur’aan is not in chronological order or arranged by subject like other texts and consists of many ayaat which calls for us to reflect. Reflection was a thing that used to be enouraged by the Ummah.
unlizzzzzzzzted, reflect on the birth of humans, reflect on our creation. Contrary to what you may have been taught, I child is not born into the world saying “La Illah illalah wa muhammadun rasullallah. ” Its language is of cooing and crying. The child is aksing for food, and shelter from the cold. What it first is aware of is it parents and of relatives, then the child begins to speak the language of his parents.
Our Prophet and the Companions were born into the world. Many were “sent” to the desert to learn the Arabic language, AND of the valor of the Arab tribes via poetry.
The sources tell us that Our Prophet, was so concerned with the condition of some of his kinfolk and of life, that he retreated to a cave where he finally received revelation. The Prophet nor the Arabs were deaf, dumb, and blind to the ways of their nations and tribes. In fact, if you were one of wisdom and knowledge of these facts, you would see where Islaam was used to “bind” together all of these different tribes under one brotherhood. And during the conquest, many battle units were formed based upon “tribal” groups. In fact, it is said that Abu Bakr was of the most knowledgable of the history of the Arabs and that this helped him in his administration of the community during the ridda.
If any sheik, mullah, mufti, mu’allam, or ustadh tells you that Islaam did away with “ties of kinship”, they are sadly mistaken and so are you. In fact, cutting the ties of kinship is not what Allah has revealed.
Yet, many here seem to believe that knowledge of the nation/tribe/language what Allah created them to be is haraam, or want to associate that with nasaba! How strange. But when they read in ahadith that “Rulership” is only destined to by for those of “Quraish”, their chests are filled with pride and entertain thoughts of the Caliphate and dealing with the kaffir. But the kaffir has knowledge not only of self, but knowledge of science and is standing with his foot right on our necks while we romanticize about the glorious Islaamic past.
Reflect unlizzzzzzzzted, Reflect, for Surely the Qur’aan is a book for those who reflect. Learn from scholars, but never stop reflecting using your own intelligence.
MaSalaama
I believe that Black Power is a symbol of challenge to everyone in the world especially Muslims AND immigrant Muslims. As a Muslim I personally don’t believe in celebrating or commomorating any holidays that are not recognized by Islam. But I think the message should be kept alive, reminding people that Allah almighty has turned the tables on humanity, especially Muslims who in Middleeast are racist, in the subcontinent are racist, in Europe / Americas are racist when it comes to skin color. Almost like the Jews, the Muslims think that we are “chosen” people but it is the “whittish” pigment of our skins that has made us chosen; with all disregard for people of dark skin. I even hate to bring up Bilal (radhi Allaho anhu) as if to act like an apologist. But the truth is he will be the first person to enter into paradise. The azaan is a reminder of the first vocal invitation to Islam for prayers. Anyway, the “black history” month should be a reminder not a part of our deen.
Here in Philadelphia there are African American Muslim hip hop artist who do kafir music, and they are looked at as good Muslims. If another people were to do and promote the music of their race/ethnicity it would be seen as bad. But since these Muslims are black it is all good. Black American Muslims have no problems making music with kafirs, as long as they are making money.
@ B-musaa……hahahahaha….Ties of kinship(silatul raahim)means includes studying and devoting time to black history….is YOUR SELF INTERPRETATION WHICH HAS NO PLACE IN THE DEEN…..bring true classical scholar to support your argument…which you dont do….Imam Suyootee’s book “Itqaan” gives 15 conditions of the “Mufasir”(interpreter of the quran) One is that he uses usool tafseer as his method to interpret…..and you DEFINATELY have left that like yusef ali and countless other fools….. B-musa said:You allude to something else that has me perplexed. Muslims who descend from the “maghrib” are encouraged to involve themselves in the plight of “Falestine” , “Iraq”, “Afghanistan” ….yes THEY’RE ALL MUSLIMS….. why not?????B-musa needs to learn basic aqeeda…Unlizzzted2009,…..@serge my organization frequents philly and ONLY a few FOOLS salute the sinful philly rap force>>>>>>>>Unlizzzzzzzzted2009
Show us where abu bakr,bilal ibn rabah,ibn abaas, and ibn masud….studied arab history and called it “ties of kinship”……such foolishness and iftee’rah …………. @Abu usamah al ass-wad….said:” I say, provide the asbab al-nuzul of the ayat if you are truthful….Go learn usool tafseer…. the asbab nuzul does not bear any weight in the ruling of the ayah(umoomal lafth wa khusoosal sabab)…..knowing your lineage and black history is nothing but a lesson on what contributions black people gave to society and other things…….No other racial groups do this in islam….except idiotic black muslims.stuck on stupid…..as far as the black sunee-salafee then he stays away from this nonsense!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! @malgo……..sayyid qutb was a journalist and was jahl and he is the grandfather of terrorism and imam ghazali was staunced in sufism(sufism=bidaa)(UNTIL Ghazali REPENTED FROM THAT) so these sources are clearly UNACCEPTABLE to list for a source ..try referring to tafseer mathur ………unlizzted2009
B-Musa, spare me your ridiculous response. Arab racism doesn’t justify favouring non-Muslims over Muslims. There is ‘ijma on the issue of takfeer of the Jews and Christians. If you got a problem with that, then your problem is with Islam, not me. I wasn’t talking about dealing with the kuffar, but favouring the kuffar over Muslims. Can you justify this from the Qur’an and Sunnah? There is clearly a trend emerging among certain African-American Muslims, who reject major aspects of Islam because it doesn’t suit their ideology of Black racialism. Look at how many of them rush to defend Obama at the slighest offense. I didn’t see this defense when the Prophet(pbuh) was attacked or when Islam is attacked daily in the media.
@ Bashir
You’re right, there is a movement amongst BAM to resurrect black racism/nationalism. You have the WD followers who never abandoned black nationalism, who train their people to hate Arabs. And then there are the racist, maliki madhab, blind followers of the known Qaddari sufi Dan fodio, who was from Nigeria. These dan fodio morons call the people to take from only african scholars–who if you research them, they are always sufi deviates.
These two groups are the main ones calling the BAM’s to this race based falsehood that can NOT be backed by the Shar’eeah!!
@ EVERYONE
If you are sincere about your Deen, and want to know how to deal with this race-based issue crap, then read the statement of ibn Taymiyyah above, and click on the link to read Shaykh bin Baaz’ refutation of Arab Nationalism.
Shaykh Abdul Azziz’s refutation of Arab Nationalism:
http://www.troid.org/dawah/methodology-of-da-wah/the-evils-of-nationalism.html
@unlissted
Thank you for your comments, from your previous comments you have proven you lack adab, now you have shown that you lack understanding.
I say thank you because rather than keeping your state of ignorance to yourself and remaining steeped in ignorance you have shared it, thus an opportunity for you to be corrected perhaps you will be shown your error (Rasheed & Tariq I already know what you are thinking, but someone may read his unopposed statements as truth)
To proceed, unlissted You said “…a lot of muslims are ignorant on basic principles in islam no need to waste time on self praise and self arrogance (i.e black history) name a companion of the prophet muhammad which pondered or studied race or linage?????? ”
Please clarify yourself, so by this question do you mean that pondering or studying race or lineage is unIslamic? Are you implying that Blackamericans are engaging in unIslamic practices by retracing and recording their lineage?
I do not know the name of any specific sahaba that speacialized in these areas of study, however the Prophet (saws) instructed the Muslims to learn their lineage. The proofs are below.
1) The Prophet (SAW) said “Learn enough about your lineage to know your blood relatives and treat them accordingly.”
2) Umar ibn al-Khattab said on the minbar, “Learn your lineages so that you can maintain ties of kinship….”
3) Ibn ‘Abbas said, “Keep a record of your lines of descent so that you can maintain ties of kinship…”
Additionally, the Prophet (saws) approved of tracing a person’s lineage through qiyafah (ie the studying and tracing of lineage and race by physiognomy), as he did not object to the qaif who examined Usamah ibn Zayd and was happy with the results.
So my question to you now is, what scholar has rejected the pondering or study of ansab, qiyafah and tabaqat (or any other related subjects) along tribal lines as valid subjects of study for the Muslims?
You said “Go learn usool tafseer…. the asbab nuzul does not bear any weight in the ruling of the ayah(umoomal lafth wa khusoosal sabab)…. ”
Yet again another reason why I no longer post ayat on blogs the ignorance of this statment doesnt even merit reply, however this simple and does require posting an ayat to refute. No ayat were revealed with a “date stamp” thus marifa asbab al-nuzul wa tartib al-nuzul are essential within tafsir al-Qur’an in order to establish the sequence in which ayat were revealed, wihout an established sequence the rulings on al-nasikh wa al-mansukh al-Qur’an would be impossible to deduced, eg for example the prohibition of wine was done sequentially in stages so not understanding the circumstances and sequence when ayat were revealed could lead to dispute about the totally prohibition of wine. So obviously you have taken the quote above out of context, again proving your ignorance.
You also said “knowing your lineage and black history is nothing but a lesson on what contributions black people gave to society and other things…….No other racial groups do this in islam….except idiotic black muslims.stuck on stupid”
I have already supplied statements of the Prophet and Sahabah on this matter but I will comment further.
This is yet another proof of your ignorance, how can you quote Imam Suyuti in a feable attempt to refute someone on tafsir totally oblivious to the fact you wrote books on Black history?
He wrote Raf’ Sha’n al-Habashah (Raising the status of the Ethiopians) extoling the virtures of Blacks, something which you claim no one does but Blacks.
In addition to Imam Suyuti there was Imam Ibn Al-Jawzi (thee preeminent student of ibn Taymiyyah) who wrote Tanwir al-Ghabash fi Fadhl al-Sud wal-Habash (The Lightening the Darkness: On the Merits of the Blacks and the Ethiopians) and who except the ignorant would claim that Imam Suyuti and Imam Ibn Jawzi were not scholars of Islam?
As for his reason for writing Tanwir al-Ghabash, Imam Jawzi writes “I saw a group of eminent Habash who were disheartened because of (their) dark color. I explained to them that respect is (granted in accordance with) good deeds rather than with good appearance, and I wrote this book to recall the virtues of a great many of the habash and the Blacks.”
Imagine that, thee preeminent student of ibn Taymiyyah writing on Black history.
So are Imam Jawzi and Imam Suyuti “stuck on stupid” for writing these works?
So go ahead disparage my kunyah or my nisabah again while proclaiming to tell me about pitfalls of bigotry, nationalism and racism, unlissted go on continue with your ignorance.
The Prophet (saws) said, “There are two courses that my Community will not abandon: wailing and attacking a person’s lineage.”
Now you what have to say?
Now what do you have to say?
Like I said al-ass-wad…go study usool tafseer and you’ll see asbabal nuzool plays no part in the rulings it gives understanding to the ayat…so trying to take asbabul nuzool and create……a ruling to study black kufarr history month.. you and the rest of your soofee buddies need to go sell crazy somewhere else!!!!!!! and you quote ahadeeth as usual with no collector!!!!! the 3 narrations of the prophet,umar and ibn abas show us who collected them and prove they’re authentic(saheeh) firstly are these books from imam jawzi and imam suyootee, about people who are black and have islam or ….the kufar you want to study and call people to studying in “black history month” and also these imam’s wrote many books on this?????? and they wrote every February ???????…..These scholars occupied a whole special month to black kufaar people ????As I said not same thing qiyaas from abu usamah al-ass-waad is full of wholes and still doesnt give you a license to practice your self made black holiday……If I was you I’d study usool tafsir…because you seem quite ignorant on how ayaat are ruled upon….Unlizzzted2009
@unlissted
you have already proven you are ignorant now you have proven youself to be a liar LOL
you wrote “so trying to take asbabul nuzool and create……a ruling to study black kufarr history month.. ” and “….firstly are these books from imam jawzi and imam suyootee, about people who are black and have islam or ….the kufar you want to study and call people to studying in “black history month”
since my very first post on this subject I have rejected the notion of singling out a certain month for Black history or creating a black holiday (the Muslim has to eids) so now realizing your intellectual deficiency you have regressed to lying LOL and name calling LOL you are a joke the sad part is that these hadith come works which you have professed to quote from in the past LOL proving yet again your ignorance LOL rather than sitting and benefitting from a scholar or applying what you’ve learned from your own erudition, you come around relying on being spoon fed.
you wrote “If I was you I’d study usool tafsir” , that’s your problem you want to be someone else, instead why don’t you just be yourself and study any field in Islam.
you wrote “…..knowing your lineage and black history is nothing but a lesson on what contributions black people gave to society and other things…….No other racial groups do this in islam….except idiotic black muslims.stuck on stupid…..as far as the black sunee-salafee then he stays away from this nonsense!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”
now you say this
furthermore
@unlissted,
furthermore… nevermind, I’m not going to cast anymore pearls at swine
@Bashir
By all means you may have my email address (Tariq give him my email I use on the blog)
Does this fatwa include the likes of Shaykh Abdul-Aziz Aal-Shaykh, Shaykh Abdullah al-Ghudayan and Shaykh Salih al-Fawzan?
Yes, I already know their are many scholars in Saudi who don’t agree with it, but they have no say.
Like a said al -ass-wad…..you have no sources for your ahadeeth……….bankrupt, bankrupt,bankrupt,bankrupt ….you cant even give the sources of ahadeeth and athaar you quote…..Unlizzzted2009 refutes a pan-ghetto-ist……al-ASS’wad……
note to self must listen to Rasheed about the tolls — if you feed them, they will come
do your own homework, if anyone else would like to have references I’ll send them to you offline, btw I’m from tha D where “cappin’” is a sport is”ass-wad” the best you have, I heard that 20 yrs ago LOL
anyway another irony of this whole discussion is that since Tariq posted this topic, Shaykh Muhammad Maliki from Saudi has begun a multi-part lecture series entitled get ready for this everyone ….
“The History of the Arabs BEFORE Islam” bam! (funky finger productions) more egg on your face unlissted
“you talk too and you never shut”
And right at the begining of his talk the Shaykh says “…and this topic is a very sensitive topic and very important subject this is Arab Hstory Before Islam and I would like to add after Islam in order to show the difference between the Arabs before Islam and after Islam and how Islam worked positively to maintain the good the goodness Arabs used to have and to protect it and beautify it…”
imagine that, Salafi Muslims learning good from a kufaar culture before Islam…
Actually, the talk was interesting can’t wait for the remaining parts.
On a side note Daud’s amir “King” Abduullah did some major “shaykhing” up the Saudi religious establishment yesterday by removing a number of those producing weird fatawa from the lajnah al-daimah replacing them with younger moderates
http://www.arabnews.com/?page=1§ion=0&article=119251&d=16&m=2&y=2009
Al-ASS-wad post the collectors of the hadeeth and athaar or be quiet……..there are many scholars to who have reflected on pagan arabia but in what light …the way black kuffar and nationalistic black muslims like yourself. Al-ASS-wad????????????,sherm da worm blackson and the others tight botany500 suit wearing nutjobs…????????…the salafi arent bankrupt like you…………..produce your sources or be quiet………ghetto-shaykh..AL-ASS-wad…….unlizzted refutes al-ASS-wad’s distortion….and lies upon scholars….
Dawud you are as igorant as they come.May Allah give you some balance and perspective.By the way were are the fatwas condemning how Africians,Asians,and others are treated in the Kingdom.What excuse will you come up with now.
Abu Usamah,
There is a quick correction: you are confusing the famous Sunni/Hanbali, (Abul-Faraj) Ibn-ul-Jawzi, who wrote extensively about clearing the (genuine) Hanbalis from the claims of the quasi-hanbalis mushabbihah/mujassimah (those who resembled Allah to the creations/claimed Allah was some sort of body/spatial entity) with the literalist (Ibn Qayyim) Al-Jawziyyah, who lived about 150 years later. Actually, the works of Ibnul-Jawzi stand as a proof against the claims of the earlier and later quasi-hanbali corporealists. Ibnul-Jawzi did not pray to a body; whereas, the quasi-hanbalis did, and continue to, pray to a (imaginary) body.
This is one of the problems here. Until the matters of `Aqidah are sorted out, one is not going to be able to intelligently understand the matters of history–and who are the “good guys” and who are the “bad guys.” Priorities are going to get skewed–BAM need to learn well the matters of `Aqidah well, and when that is done, in-sha’ Allah, other issues, such as, Fiqh and even history can be understood in their proper light.
@Swarthmoor
Thanks for the correction though this is no excuse, part the confusion stems from the fact that Abul-Faraj ibn al-Jawzi also wrote “Talbis Iblis” which is often sited by those opposed to tassawuf, again thanks for the correction.
You wrote “This is one of the problems here. Until the matters of `Aqidah are sorted out, one is not going to be able to intelligently understand the matters of history–and who are the “good guys” and who are the “bad guys.” Priorities are going to get skewed–BAM need to learn well the matters of `Aqidah well, and when that is done, in-sha’ Allah, other issues, such as, Fiqh and even history can be understood in their proper light.”
So let me get this straigth, BAMs have to be in agreement in matters of Aqidah, (not even discussing and investigating the issue) before they can even study history. And just who are they supposed to be in agreement with you? Your teacher? So matter that there has not been unanimous agreement in a thousand years, BAMs are supposed to have it correct before they can do anything else socially? Are you on crack seriously?
I’m not with this whole fasle “good guys” vs “bad guys” dichotomy, anybody whether lay people like myself or scholars can be wrong, and corrected that doesn’t make them “good” or “bad” but human.
Back to the point ibn Jawzi is a scholar — who both sufi and salafi, recognize and reference — who wrote about Black history to boost the self-esteem of Black Muslims. Stay focused by the way have you even read Tanwir al-Ghabash?
For the record I’m human and I make errors when I write, typos, missing words, incorrect word usage and other blunders. Nevertheless, the objective and fair-mined, would have to agree that the permissability to study Black history and Black lineage have been proven.
As for ‘aqidah pretty much “La ilaha illallah” and sura Al-Ikhlas sums it up for me as for the rest I’m no scholar I’ll allow you theologians duke it out.
You’ve had serveral days and the only thing you could point out is that I confused one Hanbali author with another?
@ Abu Usamah,
I’m reducing my time on the blogs. I wasn’t tryng to nit-pick but just show that there is A LOT of confusion regarding the matters of `Aqidah. There is a WORLD OF DIFFERENCE between the `Aqidah of Ibnul-Jawzi and Al-Jawziyyah (incidentally, Ibnul-Jawzi, as you know, didn’t oppose tasawwuf in principle but only some deviant practices of some claiming to be sufis). Given that `Aqidah is the most important matter, and if one doesn’t have its fundamentals straight, the person wouldn’t even be a Muslim. So i am saying the PRIORITY is the matters of the Creed. There aren’t, afterall, two “correct” beliefs in Allah. Allah is One, and Allah is not composed of organs, limbs, appendages, or other parts. We all need to be UTTERLY clear about that.
Keep in mind, i am not opposing you in principle. I don’t have a problem with African-American Muslims learning black history–i lecture on the topic, and i said that i even see to it that the Arabs and African kids i teach learn it. However, there are several caveats:
1. By whom/the manner in which it is taught (i.e., largely by negro secularists/Christians and Wally-Worlder types, who are devoid of Deen)
2. It (black history) largely reinforces a sense of vicitmization in even AA Muslims. It is mixed with this PC liberal crud that is POISON to an ignorant Muslim.
3. People are attempting to examine history without an understanding of basic Religious judgments that arise (such as, everyone being clear that slavery isn’t haraam, and African Muslims selling local pagans tribes to European pagans isn’t sinful).
4. The kaafir leaders of black America shouldn’t be seen as heroes for Muslims. Those kuffaar accomplished things under great duress, and we could lessons therefrom, but we need to apply the religious judgments that apply to the disbelievers honestly and objectively.
I haven’t read At-Tanwir. I believe the first time i saw it referenced was in Jackson’s book. I would LOVE to get my hands on a copy! I would say that BOOKS LIKE THAT–written by genuine Sunni scholars–made available in English would do A LOT for African-American Muslims. Also, for instance, learning about the traditional centers of learning in “black” Africa, such as, Timbuktu, Harar, Sudan, coastal East Africa, etc. would go a long way in the da`wah, and in helping African-American Muslims develop an identity and frame of reference outside of contemporary ghetto culture. By learning history, it would make it much MUCH MORE CLEAR what is the traditional method of learning the Deen–and what is the `Aqidah that has been taught throughout the continent of Africa and its learning institutions (prior to the petrol dollars being thrown around).
I will say it clearly and unambiguously, i don’t oppose people learning black history. What i oppose is ignoramuses/deviants talking about black history and using it as a means to call others to negro nationalism. If Muslims–with reliable knowledge OF THE DEEN–wish to discuss the subject, believe me, i’d be the first to sit and listen, in-sha’ Allah.
Abu Usamah, give me your email contact and I’ll tell you more about the fatwa.
@Bashir
I ready said you can get it from Tariq, anyway what’s the big deal why can’t you post it here?
Sweet post. I don’t suppose you’d be against it if I added your site to my linkexchange directory?